Scaphis is a Death Metal band out of Melbourne, Australia who recently released their second album, “Dissected & Fermented”. I spoke with vocalist Spyke Jagerkrieg (who joined us by audio) and drummer Lance Vegas about the new record, their formation and experiences as a band, and more. Check it out via the Metal Magnitude Official YouTube Channel below:
NAMM 2022 is a wrap, and it was good to be back. Leading up to the NAMM show, many were concerned as to whether or not it might be able to return at the same level of an event that NAMM is known to be. While I will admit it may not have been a full-scale NAMM with business entirely as usual (especially due to many artists of all genres being in the midst of summer tours), it certainly fulfilled its purpose as a gathering spot and metaphoric musical playground for merchants, musicians, industry, and more. Overall excitement and enthusiasm to be back at NAMM in person once again was enough to create a collective buzz that you could feel, and you might even be able to hear if not for the cacophony of instruments playing throughout the halls – no complaints on that here.
Before NAMM officially began, a very special event took place in Anaheim – the 10th Annual She Rocks Awards. Founded in 2012 as a networking breakfast by the Women’s International Music Network, the She Rocks Awards has grown year by year into an incredible awards show that honors leaders and trailblazing women in all genres and areas of music, from musicians to engineers, educators to execs, media to manufacturers, and more. She Rocks 2022 also featured a silent auction, with a portion of proceeds going to the NAMM Foundation, as well as helping to fund the Women’s International Music Network.
I had the immense honor of covering the Red Carpet for this event and speaking with honorees and participants this year. The red carpet interviews can be found on the Metal Magnitude YouTube Channel here, with Featured Honorees and Guests: Lyndsey Parker (Red Carpet Host and Dreaming Out Loud Award), Katie Daryl (Co-Host), Meredith Brooks (Trailblazer Award), Carmen Vandenberg (Bold Star Award), Yvette Young (Inspire Award), Mindi Abair (Co-Host/Guest Performer), Laura Whitmore (Founder of Women’s International Music Network/Co-Producer of She Rocks Awards), Leslie Gaston-Bird (Champion Award), Sherri Chung (Spirit Award), EveAnna Manley (Mad Skills Award), Julie Robbins (Powerhouse Award), Kerry Fiero (Motivator Award), MILCK (Vision Award), Command Sisters (House Band), Janet Robin (Guest Performer), Laura Clapp (Guest Performer/Past Honoree), Christina Torres (Guest Performer), Heather Youmans (Guest Performer), Tenille Arts (Opening Act), Shira Yevin (Founder of Gritty In Pink), Jennifer Jo Oberle (Guest Performer). Two additional awards for the evening: the Warrior Award given to Myki Angeline, which remained a secret until it was unveiled to her as a surprise during the show; and the Legend Award, to Dionne Warwick, who was not present for the evening due to a tour overseas, but recorded a video sending her love to She Rocks. It was an exciting night of fun and musically diverse performances – everything from Country, Pop and Rock ’n’ Roll, to Jazz, a Dionne Warwick tribute, Progressive Rock guitar, and a Meredith Brooks-led shredding “Bitch” jam to close out the night.
Photo Credit: Kevin Graft
Backtracking a little to the morning of the She Rocks awards, the NAMM goings-on all started with NAMM Media Preview Day, which gave an early look at a handful of products to be featured at the NAMM Show. It seems that multi-scale (also known as the “fanned frets” style, where each string varies in length and tension to make for easier downtuning and versatility, among other perks) is a guitar style and design that we’re seeing more and more of these days. I was able to get some time with Ernie Ball Music Man engineer Drew to talk about the new Tosin Abasi collaboration known as Kaizen: https://youtu.be/EIfUog_QpYg. I also heard about the latest metal-oriented bass innovations from Ibanez with rep Scott Miller, who gave the specs showing why the unique features of the new (soon to be released) BTB605MS and BTB806MS are ideal for a player of the heavier genres: https://youtu.be/udhg49aWBNw.
In the absence of some of the major brands such as Gibson and Fender, who usually have entire rooms to themselves, there was more space for up-and-coming, boutique, and independent brands to stand out. However, for those still seeking the household names, especially in the heavier genres, there was plenty to be found. A prime example would be the ESP guitar room, a haven for metal fans, displaying playable signature models from the likes of Kirk Hammett, Glenn Tipton, George Lynch, Gary Holt, Max Cavalera, Tom Araya, and more, including the ’87 reissue series. The room was framed with an impressive “James Hetfield & Kirk Hammett” display right outside, showing a piece of the legacy of these two metal icons who have been working with the brand since 1987.
Ibanez had their solid share of floor space in the main showroom once NAMM officially began, where Steve Vai’s “The Hydra” was on display. I heard about the innovation of this fascinating anomaly of an instrument some time ago, so my reaction to seeing it in person couldn’t be more than standing and staring for a few mintes while thinking, “…it’s real”. I don’t think I need to explain why…just look at it (and listen to it in action too). Though The Hydra took front and center stage, Joe Satriani’s JS2GD guitar also drew quite the crowd with its standout gold design, as did Nita Strauss’ JIVAX2, alongside Steve Vai’s PIA35th Prototype and new PIA3761C. Plenty of Ibanez Signature artist guitars were featured, including Mike D’Antonio (Killswitch Engage), Fieldy (Korn), Sharlee D’Angelo (Arch Enemy), Jake Bowen (Periphery), Kiko Loureiro (Megadeth), and more. Ibanez also showcased a wall of their Iron Label series, specifically designed with technical proficiency and metal shredding in mind.
Aristides Guitars had a prominent presence, where Timo Somers could be found once again manning the booth and sharing insights on his preferred guitar brand just as he did at NAMM 2020. S.I.T. (“Stay In Tune”) Strings is known for their frequent collaborations with artists in the rock and metal genres, who tailor their signature strings to their preferred gauges and styles. Some featured artist signatures at the S.I.T. booth included Willie Adler of Lamb of God, Karl Sanders of Nile, Wayne Lozimak of Hatebreed, Richard Z. Krupse and Paul Landers of Rammstein, Zach Myers of Shinedown, and Rusty Cooley. Blackstar Amplification primarily showcased their new St. James, marketed as “The Lightest 50W Valve Amp In The World”, and featured guitarist Carmen Vandenberg – a She Rocks honoree and the first woman to design and release her own signature amp – with her new CV30. During a walk through the Yamaha room, I also spotted a wall devoted to Yvette Young, an innovative musician and another She Rocks 2022 honoree.
The Haunt
I encountered a band known as The Haunt doing a signing at the Highwire Daze booth – hailing from South Florida, their sound is a Rock/Hard Rock/Alternative blend with a Gothic vibe and aesthetic, and they most recently toured with Mongolian Hard Rockers The Hu (who have featured artists Lzzy Hale and Jacoby Shaddix on some of their tracks, and also covered Metallica’s “Sad But True”). You can check out Metal Magnitude’s interview with 3/4 of The Haunt – vocalist Anastasia, guitarist Maxamillian, and drummer Nick – on the official YouTube Channel here.
Graham Bonnet’s signing followed at the Highwire Daze booth, which also drew a sizable crowd. Dianthus made an appearance later that day, the band featuring talented twin sisters who are paving their path with a unique brand of progressive metal – I recently interviewed drummer Jessica Parry for Metal Magnitude.
Chaos & Carnage 2022 Official Poster
The Chaos & Carnage Tour was something I’d been looking forward to seeing, and it was the perfect event to wrap up a day of NAMM. With a 7 band lineup, it felt more like one day of a festival than just one show, and “Chaos & Carnage” could not have been a more perfect name for this night of brutal Deathcore showcasing a plethora of talented modern metal musicians.
Distant brought the best of their Dutch Deathcore to the table setting an intense tone right off the bat, while Unique Leader labelmates Signs of the Swarm kept the mood and the pit going. Angelmaker is a band that I’ll admit I wasn’t too familiar with before this show, but one live set from them was enough to make me a fan of the dual-vocalist doomy deathcore that had the room headbanging within a minute of their first song. Winds of Plague is generally considered Deathcore, but the symphonic yet thrashy elements of their sound bring in a little more of an old-school metal sound – with no shortage of circle pits.
Lorna Shore took to the stage next, and for most in the room, it was their first time experiencing the band with new frontman Will Ramos, who’s been taking the metal world (particularly the internet) by storm with his unique and powerfully versatile vocals since “To The Hellfire” was unleashed in 2021. Bassist Michael Yager is also new to the band as of 2021, and brought his best 5-string performance to the stage. Carnifex was another highlight of the night for many, and it was my first time seeing them live even though I’ve been listening to the band for years, interviewed Scott Ian Lewis via phone in the past, and may or may not have had “Graveside Confessions” on repeat for a week or so after the single came out because it’s just that good. Suicide Silence arrived to close out the night, and this particular night at House of Blues in Anaheim – featuring new and classic tracks alike – was a unique one, as the show was recorded for a future release. Chaos & Carnage was worth every bruise from the pit (that might also be the reason why I don’t have much in the way of show photos or footage to share from this one…), and is high on the list as one of the best metal tours of 2022.
Later on in the NAMM weekend, I also stopped by Vola Guitar, a brand where Michael Keene of The Faceless has made a home with his signature guitar known as “The Keene Machine”. Vola had a few models on display that were ideally suited to players with shredding in mind – you can check out the Vola Metal rundown with Greg Lienhard, VP of Operations at the company, here: https://youtu.be/msZnqN0qjVk.
Another notable presence was that of Tsunami Cables, which is not only known for their highly durable and long-lasting cables for instruments, microphones, and speakers, but bassists of any genre may favor their latest preamp innovation, the V-15, designed by Bruce Egnater with a classic sound in mind, inspired by the heritage B-15. Not too far from Tsunami’s booth was Arachnid Cabinets, which may not yet be a household name, but they are for Gary Holt – Arachnid is part of his gear of choice for the road, and the rig pictured far left is Gary’s actual road setup.
On the tech side, JackTrip promoted their timely technology designed to connect remote musicians, enabling everything from one-on-one lessons to group rehearsals and band jams, with low-latency high-quality audio even through standard video chatting programs. Cloud Microphones demoed their ribbon microphones and mic activators, which enable an extra boost in gain and sound quality when recording or performing. Allen & Heath stood out in the American Music and Sound section of the live sound room, with new and innovative takes on the classic analog technology they’re known for, such as the dLive console, which has become one of the most popular and widely used digital consoles in the audio engineering world, and the brand also offered live sound training sessions throughout the weekend with renowned engineer and instructor Mike Bangs.
Other than the gear and gadgets one can always find on the showroom floor, NAMM had no shortage of interesting and engaging programs discussing the present and future of the music industry, including pro audio, live sound, music publishing, and promotions, in addition to concerts from new and established artists on outdoor stages all around. Anaheim and the surrounding area is always known for the shows and events that pop up at NAMM time – the She Rocks Awards and Chaos & Carnage were the notable events for me this time around, and surely there will more of the kind returning to the area for the next NAMM and beyond.
NAMM 2023 will be a spring NAMM, already scheduled for April 13th-15th, building up to a full-scale return to Winter NAMM on January 25th-28th, 2024. Follow and find more on NAMM via: https://www.namm.org.
Dianthus recently released their sophomore album Realms via Deko Entertainment, and I spoke with one half of the twin sister duo, drummer Jessica Parry, about the making of Realms, her background and influences as a musician, producers the band has worked with, and their venture into the comic world. Check it out below.
First of all, congratulations on the release of Realms – I want to start off by digging into the overall ideas of what’s on Realms, and the big picture of how the whole concept came about.
So, of course, the album artwork for Realms, it kind of tells the story already in that picture – this album is very conceptual, there’s a deeper story behind it, and we also are going to explore it in other mediums as well. It’s very fantasy and mystical-based.
Are the lyrics driven by the same fantasy and mystical ideas?
They definitely are. We also have some interludes too that kind of take you to that place. There’s a lot of synth and piano, so we play a lot on that.
The title track was revealed to us last year, before the album came out, with the music video for Realms. This is an awesome track, and very interesting because it has progressive, heavy vibes, not your standard 4/4 rock ’n’ roll time, but still very catchy and memorable without that structure. Can you talk about what went into that track?
Yeah, it was very exciting for us to write this album, and Realms was actually the first song we wrote for this record. We had lots of ideas going into it, and we wanted to write a song that kind of captured the entirety of our sound, so the synth, guitars, drums, it’s kind of like that standalone track that describes us well.
Now, “A Space In The Silence” is a more recent single we’ve heard, with another music video. It’s similar but has more of a modern melodic metal vibe, can you give us some behind-the-scenes on that one?
It was fun working on that song too, because the way it came about, we were working with our producer Steve Evetts, and he really helped us simplify certain parts where we wanted the melody to shine, so the chorus has that more simple feel with the drums. We wanted something people could sing along to live, easier to catch on to. The production was really fun, and the music video too, it takes you into that fantasy place as well.
Absolutely. You’re often called Progressive Metal by people who are getting to know you guys, it seems to be a term they hook in to, but do you put yourselves in that category, do you identify with that genre?
I actually do, and sometimes people think that we’re more pop with our vocals, but as far as progressive metal, that suits us better than progressive rock. We have the heaviness of metal, and there’s definitely odd time signatures going on, so that definitely describes us better.
That’s the thing, the time signatures are what grab people – they hear that and it’s like, “Oh, we’re getting into some Progressive territory”, which is cool.
Exactly! Yeah, thank you.
I want to ask more about your personal background, Jessica, as a musician, like what made you pick up the drums to begin with, and of course you also sing, not all drummers are singing and doing harmonies while they play – just want to know some of your inspiration with that?
I never thought I would be a drummer growing up, it’s kind of crazy how it all happened, but I started off with classical piano at age 7. My sister and I, we always wanted to be in a band together, especially since rock music was fun, we wanted to do a band, and I actually said, “it would be cool to play drums”, and that’s actually how I got into drums. I was influenced by lots of bands – Rush, my dad loved them, so that’s how it all happened.
That’s funny, you evolved from piano to singing to drums, so now you’re just doing all three at once.
Right, right! And singing, too, that came out of nowhere. My sister and I, we made songs together, and naturally live, I just started picking up backing vocals.
So when you say that you write the songs together, is that both music and lyrics all together?
Yeah, it’s teamwork together. The song itself, the structure, we usually start off with that, and then the lyrics and vocals come later.
Especially if you’re both working together on lyrics, I can see how that comes into play with you both singing as well – you’re contributing the words, the story, and the message behind the song, so you’re telling that story at the same time.
Right, it’s a process that works well for us, because we’re definitely music-based, we love coming up with that first and creating a good thing for the lyrics to sit upon.
Definitely, and I love to hear that you have a lot of classic influences in there, Rush – I mean, Neal Peart is a huge inspiration for many drummers, and I can see that’s where your progressive influence comes in.
Oh, for sure, and he was the lyricist, too, for Rush. I actually love writing lyrics too, so I relate to him a lot.
Awesome. What are some other tracks beyond the singles that really stand out to you on the album?
The last track on the record, it’s called “Secrets and Promises”, and we don’t currently have a music video for it yet, but I think that’s another fun heavier song from the record. I would describe it as a pirate metal kind of feel with the drums, and I would say it’s a lot of triplets, as we call them. Very groovy, pretty upbeat.
Now, when you say that you and your sister learned your instruments growing up, were you self-taught, was it anyone in your family, or did you take formal lessons?
We took formal lessons with the classical piano for over ten years, but also, at the same time, we were getting formal lessons in guitar and drums at a rock school academy. That really helped us get used to being in a band with other kids our age, and now we’re kind of just taking things from YouTube and self-teaching, learning things on our own now.
And I’m sure you’re getting opportunities to learn from other artists now that you’re getting more out there in the industry.
Yeah, there’s so much to learn at our fingertips now with YouTube and other platforms – every day is something crazy online *laughs*.
*laughs* Absolutely. I’m also curious, because sometimes when people come from a classical background, that’s a very structured, strict way of doing things – you’ve got your sheet music to play things the way they’re written and that’s that. So going from that to a band setting, where a lot of it is open and free, and jamming until you find the sound as you go along. How was that transition?
It was really fun. For me personally, going from classical piano, which, yeah, is a lot of theory and dynamics…going into drums, I felt like I had more space to breathe, more freedom if you will, because there’s not actual pitched notes going on. I still play a lot of the piano too, but with drums, it’s another fun side to music that I just release.
And I see that you do a lot of covers on social media too, so I’m curious, what’s the process of picking those out – do you just get in the mood for a certain song and say, “You know what? I’m going to cover this now”, or is it long-time favorites that you’ve been building up to?
Sometimes it’s just based on feeling – I’ll have short bursts where I’m listening to a certain song and I’m like, “Wow, I didn’t realize how cool the drums were”. It’s like a revisiting thing for me, and manifesting certain skills, that I can actually record certain parts that I didn’t think I could years before. It’s just fun to see my progress and see how other people feel.
You definitely get a different insight on music when you learn new instruments, I’m sure you’re able to notice exactly when the drums are hitting what, you kind of tune into it more.
Yeah, that makes sense because when you revisit other songs, you have more of an appreciation for it. You can also experiment with your own style, different drum fills, it’s cool to find your own thing.
And that’s where covers can really shine through, because you’re putting your own touch on it. It’s fun to do covers paying tribute to the original artist, but it’s great to put your own spin on it as well.
Definitely, music has to be fun in the end. You’ve got to make sure you’re having fun, and a good challenge is always good too.
You mentioned working with Steve Evetts as a producer as well, and he’s done a lot of metal for sure, but he also has some alternative and other genres under his belt as well – what do you feel his touch brought to the Dianthus sound?
Definitely his experience with other bands has helped us mold our sound too, he’s worked with pop-punk bands like New Found Glory – actually, at the same time as recording our album, he was working with these other pop-punk bands too. He has such a good ear for radio-ready songs, and coming into the process, we had all these crazy technical ideas, and he kind of calmed us down at certain parts to simplify and let the music take over.
That’s pretty funny, you had all these crazy progressive ideas and he’s just like, “All right, guys – tone it down”.
Right, if you want to reach more people, they have to understand the song, and you can’t get too crazy at certain parts.
Some progressive metal – and, what am I saying, some Rush – can get really crazy and out of hand, but sometimes even their craziest songs were radio-friendly, as long as you’ve got a hook, a melody, something that people can grab onto.
That is true, yeah, there’s always a flipside to everything.
That makes sense with his pop-punk/alternative background, that makes things very melodic and catchy, and that helps explain why you have that “almost drawn from pop” sort of song structure…but it’s not pop, of course, but just the structure of a memorable, catchy chorus that people can come back to.
And another thing to add to the reason why we kind of calmed down at some parts – it was something we never really tried before, so we were open-minded because our first record was definitely very progressive and we wanted to try simplifying certain parts, and seeing how people would react.
Right, and of course, your previous album, Worth Living For, that was produced by JINXX from Black Veil Brides, can you talk about evolving your sound with him?
Yeah, well, to start off, Black Veil Brides played a huge part in inspiring the Dianthus sound, very melodic, kind of bright at some parts. So working with him hands on was super cool. My sister was able to come up with a lot of great guitar tones, certain riffs, we had harmonies, guit-armonies, going on. So it was a really cool thing.
You also signed to Deko Entertainment in the past couple of years, so I wanted to ask about that experience and how that connection first came about?
We love Deko Entertainment, and we love the team we have now. It actually started from creating our Realms album, because Steve actually knew one of the team members from Deko. So naturally, when we were having our songs mastered, it went to someone who kind of knew of Deko, so that was how we got connected.
You mentioned having this fantasy world of Dianthus and Realms in other forms, so what is this I’m seeing about a Dianthus comic book to go with Realms? You’re giving me a throwback to when Kiss came out with comic book characters when they first came out. Talk to me about that project?
Definitely, it was an idea from one of our team members at Deko. He kind of suggested they’d be cool to kind of dive deeper into the story of the albums, because there’s only so much that you can tell through music, that you need that extra visual to supplement the storyline. We never started any comic books before – we’re not too much comic book junkies, but we love the idea of doing it, and plus we know the whole scene in comics is pretty huge, so it’s pretty exciting. We think it will definitely help the fans understand the concepts more for sure.
You’re talking about the visuals of the band, through the comics and music videos, but I feel like the fashion and general aesthetic is part of the visual for your live show as well. You have the Victorian Goth appearance that a lot of symphonic metal bands tend to do, but without being a symphonic metal band yourselves.
It’s kind of interesting, yeah, we’ve always loved the Victorian style, and combining that with metal, we think it has a really cool intrigue. Plus, Victorian has a lot of black clothing and kind of fanciful wardrobes, so we just like the look of it. We kind of want to become characters in a way to really tell our music better.
As a drummer, do you have any go-to gear or brands that you work with that you’re particularly fond of?
Yeah, as far as drumsticks, I always use Vic Firth even since I picked up the drums, it was the main brand that I really gravitated to. So they’re great – I love Zildjian cymbals too, especially the darker kind of K cymbals, those are pretty good for our sound, and I play Tama drums.
What about the flower of Dianthus did you identify with that made you say, this just feels like the right band name?
It’s actually interesting how the band name came about – my sister was looking through different plant and flower names, and then she came across Dianthus so of course we had to look up an image of it, and the flower itself has kind of rough edges, but it’s also very bright. Plus it sounds kind of metal, people don’t really know that it’s a flower, so it seemed natural to choose that one as our name.
It does feel like a natural name for a metal band – when I looked it up and actually saw flowers come up too, I was like, “wait…what?” *laughs*
*laughs* It is a funny surprise there.
But it is mostly content about you that comes up when you put “Dianthus” in at this point, so you’re overcoming the flower results in Google!
*laughs* Exactly, I told my sister that maybe we should tweak the spelling or lettering, but I think it’s cool.
Another exciting thing that I see coming up for Dianthus is that you have some support slots for Angel at the legendary Whisky a Go Go and Count’s Vamp’d, two very well-known venues in the rock world, have you played either of those before?
Well, we’ve played the Whisky before, but Count’s Vamp’d in Vegas, we’ve always wanted to play there, so we’re very excited that we’re finally playing that place in June.
Awesome. I also want to ask a little bit about Jessica outside of the music world, and what else you’re into?
For sure, I’m definitely an artistic person, I’ve always loved to sketch and draw, but in my free time outside the band, I like to create graphics. I like to do a lot of the posters, actually, so it all comes back to the band in a lot of ways, I love designing graphics. I also love to go antique shopping, my sister and I love to do that – it’s therapeutic for us.
That’s fun, and I feel like that also ties right back into the band since you have the vintage Victorian aesthetic. Even if it’s something that’s a hobby, you still end up using it for the band.
Right, *laughs* it all comes back to the band, it’s always art-based.
To wrap things up, what’s on the horizon for Dianthus at this point?
We’re excited to be continuing to play shows here in the area – we’re based in Riverside, CA, so we’ve got some shows coming up, and also in the summer with Angel on June 10th and June 11th, so keep an eye out for those dates – and those tickets are available now.
Awesome, thank you so much for your time today, Jessica!
Once Human just unleashed their new album, Scar Weaver, to the world via earMUSIC, and I had the chance to speak with frontwoman Lauren Hart about the making of the album and videos, how she started her journey of metal vocals, her involvement in animal rescues, and more. Check it out below.
Congratulations on the release of Scar Weaver, it’s an absolutely incredible album – just to start off, how are you feeling now that it’s out? Excited, relieved, exhausted, where are you guys right now?
Oh, I’m excited and relieved. We’ve held onto this album for quite a while because of the whole world shutting down, we wanted to release it even a year before it actually got released, so we’re just super grateful that it’s out. I’m really excited about the response, and looking forward to hearing what everyone thinks of it.
Well, I’ve been listening to it, even up to just a few minutes before speaking to you, it’s absolutely a killer album, I’ve been loving the singles that have been coming out, and you guys really have some awesome stuff on your hands.
Thank you.
Now, this is Once Human’s third full-length album, and it’s got everything, it’s brutal but meaningful, and I just want to start kind of general before really digging into it, moving from Evolution in 2017 to Scar Weaver now, how did you first approach constructing this new album?
Well, there’s a massive difference in the music writing this time around, so Logan was on tour with Machine Head doing the 25th Anniversary Burn My Eyes reunion, and when he came home, Max Karon, our lead guitarist, had written ten full songs for the album, and they were done. And Logan thought they didn’t need to be touched, so this whole album musically was written by Max, and then I’ve written all my lyrics. But previously, music was written as a collaborative effort between the three of us, so that’s one of the biggest things is you really get an inside look at Max’s brain and his emotions, and he was allowed to be 100% himself in the writing. So that’s Scar Weaver.
That’s really cool, and also kind of explains why, like you said, you guys kind of had this on hand already for a while, but you just couldn’t release it, because you went into it with ten songs ready to go.
Yeah, we did, we were ready a while back, but then when we were sitting in a house, in a studio, for this whole time, things did get changed and songs were rewritten just because we had the time. And I, of course, took my time with the lyrics because I’m a perfectionist, so time is not a good thing for me *laughs*, I need deadlines.
So if you had all the time in the world, you’d probably end up changing it a hundred times, right?
I’d never be done! It’s never done!
Well, you got it done, though! It’s locked in, and it is where it is now, so you can’t change it now.
*laughs* No, I know, I’m happy with how it came out, I always am. Once it’s delivered, it’s done, but I’m really happy with how everything turned out, no regrets at all.
Awesome. Lauren, you are notably one of the most powerful vocalists in metal today, and of course, everyone notices the growling vocals alone which are so impressive, but it seems like you’re including even more clean vocals than ever before, which are every bit as powerful. So what drove the clean vocals for this album?
100%, it was the touring that I did with Kamelot for two years prior to this album. I grew a lot with them. Before touring with them, I was still very unsure of myself when it comes to clean vocals – a little bit insecure, I guess you would say. I always felt very confident in my screaming, but the cleans, I was staying in my safe zone a lot in previous writings, and not really exploring things outside of my comfort zone. So Kamelot really threw me into the deep end, and I had to sing songs that Alissa White-Gluz and Elize Ryd from Amaranthe sang, and it’s a completely different genre, style, but then doing it every night on stage, I really grew into my own voice and discovered my own voice from that. I wouldn’t call it extreme confidence, but I did overcome some fears, and I think that really shows on the new album.
Absolutely, it’s a great infusion of the clean vocals – it doesn’t distract from your incredible screaming vocals, it’s kind of peppered in to have something a little bit different. So that also makes me wonder, when you first started becoming a vocalist, did you start from screaming right out of the gate?
Yes! Okay, so the first time I ever heard a woman screaming was The Great Kat, you know, but I wanted to be a guitar player, and she sort of screams a little bit on her album that I listened to. But then when Wages of Sin came out, I heard Angela Gossow screaming, and at first, I thought it was a guy, and when my friends were like, “no, this is a girl, here’s her photo”, I was like, “this beautiful, amazing woman is screaming on this album?!” I just felt so inspired to go in and try it. It was my boyfriend at the time, now my ex, I was a teenager, after his band would be done rehearsing, I would go in and ask, “Can I please just play with you guys on the microphone? Let me scream and you guys just free jam or whatever?” and they would let me and I would always come out of that tasting blood and screaming completely wrong. There was no YouTube to tell me how to do it. But yes, I always was into screaming. And by the way, if you taste blood you’re doing it wrong! I didn’t know what I was doing back then, but then I grew and I learned. I took some theatre classes which taught me how to breathe, project and speak right, which is what I now use in my screaming in order to not injure myself. Also, I’ve been recently working with a vocal coach as well, that’s really helped me along with the screaming. So the cleans came a lot later for me.
I love that, I feel like that’s a unique journey for you – a lot of people do just dive right into it, but usually there’s maybe a little bit of a singing background, or they took a few lessons here and there then discovered their screaming voice, but you were just like, “I’m just going to jump right in and scream like everyone I was inspired by”, which is cool.
Yeah! It made me feel something, you know, it just felt so good listening to it then actually getting on a microphone and doing it felt, almost therapeutic in a way. So I got hooked on that.
Well now everyone is hooked on the sound of your voice, so I think it worked out.
Thank you!
Of course! Digging a little more into Scar Weaver, I wanted to ask about the music video for “Erasure”, because you’ve been saying lately that that’s one of your favorites, so can you talk about what made that video so special for you, and some of the process behind it?
I just love the visual. So that area where we did all the extra footage with, I call her “Lady Death”, the black dress stuff…that was shot at Red Rock Canyon, and that’s a place that we would hike very frequently. I posted a lot of photos up there, and a lot of people were like, “You guys should do a music video up here”, so we did. And we made the poor videographer hike up a mountain to get those shots in the middle of summertime in the desert. So, props to him for doing that! But the message of the video as a whole, director Robert Graves really made it come to fruition. It’s about blood diamonds, and I think he really paints the image so beautifully and painfully about the story that the lyrics are painting here. These things that are going on still to this day, basically, how humans, their rights are stripped away and they are enslaved and tortured for the sake of these rocks that, ironically, are given to people as a token of love. It’s a very emotional video to me, and I feel like the director Robert Graves did a really good job of putting it together.
It’s an important message, like you said, and it’s also visually very impressive. I definitely think it made a lot of sense to put this in the setting of nature…and Red Rock is awesome, by the way, I’ve been there myself, it’s a beautiful place and crazy impressive, so, good choice.
Yeah, it really looks like a diamond mine. It was crazy. This is Red Rock in Nevada, you’d never expect it, down the road from all these casinos is this gorgeous nature *laughs*.
Exactly! But the nature was there first though.
True, very true.
You mentioned hiking, and I notice from your social media that you’re big on fitness and hiking – is that something that’s a lifelong passion for you, or something you’ve discovered in more recent years?
No, I remember my dad would bring my brother and I to the gym as kids, and I think it all started then. It was like this family event and I enjoyed going there with him, and back then they had these funny little bikes where you could see your bike going on the screen and my brother and I would race each other, it was a fun little time. But I never stopped going to the gym, I was constantly there, and hiking has been a passion of mine – the hikes in Australia are the most beautiful hikes you would ever imagine. There’s so much nature to explore and an animal around every corner, so I’m hooked on hiking and I’ve been really lucky to explore parts of Switzerland and Germany and so on while on tour. It’s really just where I find myself, and find peace, and refresh my brain, is when I’m out hiking in nature.
That’s beautiful, and really important to be able to find that inner peace, whatever environment you feel that in. Coming back to Scar Weaver, another thing that people can’t stop talking about is the collaboration with Robb Flynn on “Deadlock”, and that’s such a cool track. Your voices work together so well on it too. Can you talk about how that collaboration went down in terms of the writing, recording, just making it all happen?
Well, I’m really grateful it did happen, and I don’t think it would have happened if it wasn’t for the end of the world. And it’s one of those things that restored hope in me that good things can happen in the worst of times. And I think it wouldn’t have happened because Rob simply wouldn’t have had the time, he would have been on tour, he would have been super busy – so he had the time to sit down and do this with us and I’m so grateful. We didn’t expect him to say yes – Logan immediately thought of Rob for this track because of how it sounded. I guess you could say it has some Nu-Metal-type riffs in there, we just really heard a voice like Rob’s singing on it. We asked, and Rob really loved the track, and said, “yeah, let me try something”. He sent something back to us, I had already written a chorus prior to sending it to Rob, but when he sent it back, my chorus was gone and his was on there – and it mopped the floor with my chorus, he put me to shame! Now, I can’t even remember mine, his was so much better. Rob knows how to make those hooks, and then we didn’t expect him to say yes to doing a video with us, but he did. Then this amazing video came out of it too, and then we were able to play it together on stage when we were on tour with Cradle of Filth. That was so much fun, it’s been a massive dream come true, and I’m really glad people like it.
Absolutely, it’s a killer track. Don’t knock your own songwriting, of course, you definitely come up with some awesome stuff yourself. But sometimes that is part of the nature of collaborating, sometimes your ideas kind of get knocked out of there, but you’re still happy with what comes out at the end.
I know, I’m just such a huge fan of Rob, and I’m a huge fan of Machine Head, so of course I’m just going to fangirl out on anything he sends, especially if it’s on a Once Human track, it’s like, “Oh my God, this crushes!”
Great job on both you guys’ part, and of course, everybody involved, the whole band. Which brings me to ask – personally, I really loved the “Cold Arrival” single, I was fascinated with that one when it came out, I think I had it on repeat for a couple of days at least.
Oh, thank you.
It was just epic and powerful, so of course I want to ask about your ideas and the songwriting behind it, but it also kind of leads me to ask about production as well. All the songs on Scar Weaver sound amazing, but “Cold Arrival”, there’s just something about it, the tone and everything that comes through – the vocal layering of clean and growls together, just everything. I just wanted to ask about the process behind that song and what you guys put into that.
Well, I can only speak for the lyrics here, because Max did the writing of the music on this song. I know that the chorus was a standalone riff, the main part where I scream “cold arrival”, that was a riff without a song around it at first, and I told Max we have to build a song around this. And we used to say, “can you write something around this Danny Elfman riff?” *laughs* It had this Danny Elfman-type sound. So that’s really all I can say about the music because Max wrote it, I don’t want to speak for him. But lyrically, the song is about a friend of ours that died in 2020. He was our fitness coach in spin class and became a friend to the three of us, Max, Logan, and I – we would all go to his spin class nearly every single day, and a lot of times it was just us in the room. Jared would play metal music for us, he let us borrow his spin bike for the tour – he was just a really great guy, and really young, really healthy. He just died unexpectedly and it really did a number on me. I was not expecting it. I think everybody sort of prepares themselves with their grandparents or something, you understand what’s going to happen in the near future, you prep yourself. But this was a very young man, just suddenly gone. It was also my very first experience with death, so I did a lot of my grieving process in the lyrics, it’s a very sad song. It’s difficult for me to listen to it because of that.
Well, I’m very sorry for your loss. It hits hard, something like that, and especially someone so young, so I’m very sorry to hear about your loss. I guess the consolation is having that creative outlet for yourself, that you were at least able to pour that grieving into making something amazing out of it – sonically, lyrically, everything that you could draw out, and hopefully help yourself feel better in the process.
Yes.
Something else I wanted to ask you about, “Eye of Chaos” seems to be a fan favorite from Evolution, I feel like a lot of people tend to refer to that song and video as a great example of the sound and image of Once Human overall. I was wondering if there were some Once Human songs that are band favorites, or personal favorites for you, Lauren, that you feel represents you the best.
Well, definitely “Eye of Chaos”. That one, I think, a lot of people love, and a lot of people that are learning screaming apparently like to choose that one. So it’s really special, it was also – going back to one of your first questions, sort of what helped me come into my own as a writer, and sort of when the penny dropped and I was able to connect lyrically with something that happened in the world. The lyrics to that song had come together a lot like “Erasure” lyrics, it was something that had happened in the world that I learnt about and felt really compelled to write about, something that affected me deeply. “Gravity” is another one I feel fans really loved. It’s hard to say on Scar Weaver just because I really feel like we know what hits people the hardest when we play it live, and we have yet to play these songs live. But what I’ve been hearing is “Cold Arrival”, “Only In Death”, but yeah, I think definitely “Eye of Chaos” would be the one.
I think it will definitely be exciting to see what people gravitate toward once you get out there and play Scar Weaver live. Outside of the music world a bit, I saw from your Instagram that you recently got involved with an animal rescue organization, and you definitely have a lot of animal-related posts, so I’d just love to hear more about this, your involvement and love of that.
Well, I’ve only just discovered Animal Tracks, I was just there last week – it’s an animal rescue in LA, and I was invited by my friend Jess. Yes, I have a history of being involved in animal rescues and working as a veterinary technician in Australia. I’ve really devoted a lot of my life to animals, and do whatever I can. It’s something I’d like to do more of, that’s for sure, I would love to spend more time at Animal Tracks, and if anyone out there is listening, you can go check it out. There’s a fundraiser as well, if you’re interested in saving some animals and giving them a nice, new home. A lot of these animals come from – either they’re retired circus animals or surrendered pets that people realize, “oh, I can’t have this wild animal in my house”, or injured wildlife in general that end up here. And it’s really sad to see all these wild animals in cages, but at the same time, where would they be without this place? Animal Tracks, I saw, really provided good enrichment, they pair the animals up or put them in groups so they’re not lonely – everybody needs a friend – except the solitary animals, of course. I really thought that they did a good job, and I look forward to spending more time here and doing what I can.
Awesome! That’s great, and it’s easy to hear that you have a genuine interest and passion for this. I’m an animal lover myself, so I totally relate. This has been really awesome getting to know more about you and talking about the new album today, so I’d like to wrap it up with a little view of what’s on the horizon for Once Human?
Hopefully, we tour and we don’t come home for a really long time. I guess it’s just up to the world to see if that happens. We’re releasing, unfortunately, in unknown territory, so we will have to see. But that’s the goal, and hopefully we can make that happen.
Well, everyone is waiting for it to happen, so hoping for the best over here. Thank you again so much for your time today, this has been awesome talking with you, Lauren.
Geoff Tate recently kicked off the 2022 Empire 30th Anniversary Tour in the US, where he’s performing the classic Queensryche albums Empire and Rage For Order in their entirety live with his current band. For this week’s Q&A, we’re bringing one back from the archives of 2021, when I spoke with Geoff about his Sweet Oblivion project, his lifestyle and recording during the pandemic, the Insania Wine brand, and more. Check it out below.
It’s been a while since you and I have chatted for an interview, I think the Metal Hall of Fame in 2020 was probably the last time, and honestly, after the way this past year’s been going, that seems like ages ago. How have you and your family been doing through all this?
Oh, I think like everybody, we’ve all been going through an adjustment period. It’s been a unique time in history, you know, we’re all affected by it on a number of different levels. People have lost their jobs, or have a shifting relationship with their job. For me, it’s been the first time in…I don’t know, thirty years that I’ve been in one place for so long of a time. In 2019, I was home for 23 days of the year, so I spend most of my traveling on the road in different place every day, and I’m used to that, and being off the road has been like that Groundhog Day movie, you know? Every day you wake up, you’re looking at that same clock, that same table, and you’re going through this routine – I’ve never lived that way. So it’s weird for me, and I’ve had a bit of a struggle trying to figure out how to live like that. But I’ve managed to do a lot this year work-wise, I’ve completed one album and I’ve got the second one nearing completion, and I’ve got two others in the works. So I’ve got a lot of music ready to go for release over the next couple of years, been doing that, mostly.
That’s great you’re keeping active in the music world even though you’re not able to physically get out there and tour – you’ve always seemed to keep busy with other bands and projects outside of your own. Of course, one of the latest ones is the new Sweet Oblivion record, the second album, Relentless. So how did the Sweet Oblivion band and project first come about?
Well, I asked for it. *laughs* After finishing my time with Queensryche, I was looking to work with different people and try some different musical endeavors. I had signed up with Frontiers Records to do a three-album set of Operation: Mindcrime trilogy records. I was talking to Mario from the record company one day, and I said, “Yeah, I really want to try something different, work with some different people, especially producers, engineers, and other musicians. If you have any ideas on that, or something comes across your desk, let me know”, and he said he would, then we kind of went our separate ways, and I was off doing my own thing. A year or two later, he called me up and said, “I have an idea, and it’s called Sweet Oblivion”, and he told me what his idea was for it, and I thought it was great. So I started working with some Italian writers and producers, and thus we have Sweet Oblivion. There’s two records, I did one a few years ago, and now this one. There’s different musicians and producers on each record, the only constant is me *laughs*. So, it’s been really fun and an interesting journey, working with international musicians and players, I’ve been enjoying it.
That’s funny how the only constant is you, so having a different cast of characters on each album, how did you go about following up on the first record?
We did it in kind of interesting way, that maybe a lot of people would find strange, but it actually makes a lot of sense. We worked in different studios in different continents and countries, and we meet together in the studio of the internet, passing our files back and forth to create the songs. And it’s actually an interesting and fun way to work, you’re able to sit in the comfort of your own studio that you’ve created, your happy place, and live the way you want to live, and still work together. It’s efficient.
Especially when you’re working internationally. In recent years, bands have been going for more of the remote style of recording, sending files back and forth, that’s increasingly more common, but it’s funny how the whole past year has made it almost mandatory, that’s the only way you can do it right now.
Exactly, and necessity is the mother of invention, as they say. But really, when you break it down and look at it, the reason we all sat in the same room and worked is because that’s the only way we had to do it. We were limited by technology of the times, and basically, the recording studio is a completely different animal now than it was then. The studio I carry around in my suitcase and set up in my hotel room every day, is more powerful than Abbey Road Studios in London, where so many great records have been made. So why go there? Unless you’re shooting a video, or happen to be in London and need the drum room that they have. It’s a new way of working, I think after the pandemic, a lot of people that have never worked this way before will continue to work this way now.
Yeah, I think that’s been one of the most prevalent message people have been getting from this whole past year, is realizing, “Hey, I could do this entire job from home. Why should I even return to the workplace?” So it’s going to be interesting to see how things develop once we get back to…“normal”, whatever “normal” is going to look like now. Companies in the industry, musicians in recording studios, everyone’s adapting their working style now, a lot of lessons have been learned for the past year.
And I think this can be applied to pretty much everything in life. Typically, the reason why we do something is because that’s the way we were taught to do it, by whoever taught that person who taught us, and we tie things up in the idea of tradition. Tradition doesn’t always mean the best way to do something. It’s shifting the focus on how to do something in a more efficient way, which is so much better. Over the last couple of years, I bought an electric car and it’s really changed my perspective on driving and traffic, and just about everything related to automobiles has changed. The way I drive is different, it teaches you to be much more efficient. I’ve got to tell you though, driving an electric car, my stereo sounds amazing and I love listening to music in the car again. Because, man, I can hear everything. Before, there was so much engine and road noise, and exhaust pipe noise, man, you can’t hear the details in music. But now, the car is so damn quiet, the music really shines.
Nice, that definitely makes for more enjoyable road trips and rides then.
Absolutely.
Well, we’re talking about learning to adapt and work remotely, but one thing that can’t really be replaced is live shows, of course. I see that you have some shows coming up later this year, a UK and European run, then some shows in the US. It looks like things, at least in terms of everyone’s planning, are starting to come back up again.
Yeah, state by state, opening at different capacity levels, and we’ve been looking to adapt to those rules and structures. It’s exciting to see things are opening up now, and I have to say that my management and my agent have been working strenuously just to organize the shuffling of dates. They’ve been working on it all this year, and we’re basically picking up where we left off. We were on tour last March when everything just shut down, so we’re gearing up to continue that tour. Of course we made commitments to the promoters, and we’ve always worked to honor those commitments, and to the fans who expect to see the show. We’re gearing up to bring that back out.
Awesome. I think a lot of people still feel like it’s proceeding with caution, we’re all hoping, but there’s still that bit of uncertainty of whether it’s going to go on.
When you think about it, everybody lost their shows, and so everybody’s vying for the venues now, in hopes that they’re all opening up. We have a show in the Seattle area here coming up, and we sold the amount of tickets that they’re allowing us to sell, but then there was some speculation from the state government saying that we’re going to have to roll back our numbers to those from several months ago because we’ve had an uptick in the amount of cases, so that means for us, that we’ve oversold the venue. So now it’s like, “What do we have to do?” My management’s been working with the venue to see if we’re going to have to split the show into two shows, or how we’re going to do this. But then, the governor made another announcement this past week saying, “No, it’s okay, we’re going to allow the capacity to be what it was, and we’re actually upscaling the capacity now”, so it’s all good, no more panic. *laughs*
Definitely, it seems to be getting better as time goes along. Now, a couple of years ago, you did the Operation: Mindcrime Anniversary tour, and now it’s going to be the 30th Anniversary tour for Empire and Rage For Order together, so is it going to be literally a full show of those two albums back-to-back?
Back-to-back, yes. It is a really good show, when we were doing it this past year, before the pandemic kicked in, it was absolutely stunning and I was so proud of my band for being so on point, playing so well. The audiences were turning out at sold out shows, there was just this momentum of everything being just right, and I felt really healthy and good, I was singing well, and it was really a shame when the whole thing had to be unplugged and postponed. But we’re gearing up to bring it back out, and hopefully we’ll get back up on that roll of playing at the top of our game again.
Absolutely, and it’s an easy to decide setlist at this point, because you already know what the songs are going to be start to finish. Have you been digging into tracks in rehearsals with the band during this time?
Oh, you have to rehearse this stuff. It requires a lot of work to make it where it should be, presentable. I don’t like to go out and do things that are not perfection, I like to make it as good as I can possibly do it. I have the band fly in, typically two weeks before the first gig, and we spent two weeks just really fine-tuning it to where it should be, you know?
Good stuff. So outside of the music world, how is the Insania wine business going?
Oh, the wine is flowing, yes.
As it should be.
As it should be, yeah! People say, “Oh, I bought a bottle of your wine, I’m saving it”, I say, “No, don’t save it, drink it, I’ll make more”. *laughs* I’m looking forward to October because that’s our wine festival, when we do our harvest with the grapes, and actually crush the wine and get it rolling through the next vintage. We have a big party every year at the winery, and thousands of people show up, it’s become kind of a thing. The hotels in the area sell out, it’s crazy, and it’s all free. Maybe that’s why it seems to sell out, *laughs* it’s free.
*laughs* That helps!
That helps, yeah. But it’s a really fun time. Last year, in October, that was the first time that I didn’t get to go to the harvest, and I of course had to Zoom call with my winemaker and talk to him about the harvest and how the grapes are looking, and he was keeping me abreast of all the developments, but it’s so strange not to have tasted the vintage yet. Because typically I’m there and I’m doing it, and I’m really involved. This last year, of course, we couldn’t do that. But I’m looking forward to getting back to Germany for it.
Even winemaking went virtual, what has the world come to?
*laughs* Yeah, really!
No, but there definitely seems to be a lot of things to look forward to for this year, and you’re still been staying productive. It’s great you keep people updated on social media with everything you’re doing, I just saw you posted the Pink Floyd tribute album, as well as The Prog Collective, and it’s clear you’re keeping busy with a lot of things in spite of not being able to play shows.
Yeah, well, I keep getting these offers from people to get involved with their scene and what they’re doing, and some of the stuff, I really like a lot, so why not?
Well, definitely some great stuff on the horizon, especially with Empire and Rage For Order getting back out on the road, so I’m glad to hear everything’s going well in the world of Geoff Tate, and I’m looking forward to seeing more from you later this year.
Thank you, Chelsea, and thanks for the interview today, I appreciate it.
Metal Magnitude started this list during the 2020 lockdown to keep track of livestreams across the rock and metal world, updating with upcoming shows while keeping an archive of past ones that are still available to stream. While the world is still not back to “normal” quite yet, there are now more concerts and tours taking place in person (finally!) than ever before, but some artists are still taking the livestream route from time to time. For now, this list will stay up on the site, so keep an eye out for updates, and if you know of any upcoming livestreams, please submit the link and details to submissions@metalmagnitude.com, or reach out via social media. Thanks for the support and Happy 2022!
**Update 2021**
We may not be able to go to concerts to see our favorite artists during these crazy days of Covid-19 and social distancing – but that hasn’t stopped our favorite artists from bringing the shows to us. Virtual concerts are becoming the new norm during these times, and whether we’re reliving an iconic moment in a band’s live history, participating in a live Q&A with an artist, or watching a living room or garage performance in real time, there’s plenty to keep us entertained. Metal Magnitude has assembled a masterlist of virtual content in the Metal/Rock/Hard Rock genre so you can plan out your concert calendar from the comfort of your home – the list is continually expanding, so be sure to check back for updates. If you have, represent, or know of a band with livestreaming content coming up, submit the links and details to submissions@metalmagnitude.com or reach out via social media so it can be added to the masterlist. Support our community and spread the word!
Motörhead just released a new boxset with Everything Louder Forever – The Very Best Of, out this past weekend via BMG. In light of the new release, here’s an interview from earlier this year, when the Louder Than Noise…Live In Berlin boxset came out, and I spoke with longtime Motörhead guitarist Phil Campbell about the release, plus his own band Phil Campbell and The Bastard Sons.
Our main focus is of course, the Louder Than Noise…Live In Berlin Motörhead release, so to start things off, what are your thoughts on this particular show being released in audio/visual form now?
Yeah, we were looking through a lot of audio tapes and everything, and we found some interesting things. We recorded most of the shows, we didn’t visually tape every show, but when we listened back to the audio of the Berlin show, it just sounded really, really killer, so we checked the footage out and everything. So we’re really excited. I think it was the last show in Germany of our little group of shows that we did – Germany’s always been good to us, Europe’s always been good to us. We thought it was about time to put out something new for the fans.
Absolutely, and I read that this was about 12,000 people, and one of the biggest German audiences you had ever had – Motörhead was always filling arenas, of course, but I suppose this was a particularly large one for you guys.
Yeah, it was probably the biggest indoor place we may have played in Germany! There was lots of people there. I didn’t count them all individually, but about 12,021, lots of eyes.
Live In Berlin is actually the second live release to be released since we unfortunately lost Lemmy. How is it for you to revisit live shows through these releases, and do you find yourself reminiscing on the tours at all?
I miss Lem every day, you know. He’s in my mind all the time, I still get a great thrill out of listening to us live. Believe it or not, you could count the amount of bad gigs we had on one hand, you know? We were always pretty much on fire with the live shows and everything. It’s just a shame that we can’t do it any longer really, but you try and think of the good times rather than the reality of it, really. But it’s good music, it’s going to be there for many years to come. We left a good body of work, I think.
Absolutely! It’s solid, and there’s so many fans helping to keep the Motörhead spirit alive, as well as what you guys are doing with all the new releases. There’s been a good amount of new releases since 2015, you had the live albums, the boxsets, a cover compilation. And it’s cool that there still seems to be things out there to be uncovered and released.
Yeah, there’s going to be things out there, it’s just that we’re not spending 24 hours a day going through everything for six months. When we come across something, me and Mickey, we’ll have a chat about it and try and make some decisions, and just put stuff out which we think our fans will really like, without giving them the same stuff over and over again. We want some urgency in the music, and some balls, make sure it’s all sounding ballsy. So yeah, it’s quite interesting, we listen back to stuff, and you can’t even remember playing it, or you can’t remember that you this song live. There’s still lots more stuff to sift through, there’ll be varying degrees of recording quality in that, but I’m sure there’s lots of really top-notch recordings around, just got to get to them.
And that’s something to look forward to on the part of the fans, whatever you come across, you share with us, and it feels like we become part of that experience and those memories. And about the recording quality, I don’t think anyone is worried too much about that, if you find something that’s not been released before, cool old demos or live recordings, I don’t think anybody’s going to say, “oh, but this is not a top quality production”. *laughs*
But I do.
Ah, good point.
*laughs* So, you know, you can let a few things slide, but if something goes out, we’ve got to live with it for the rest of our lives. So we try and make sure it’s up to our standards and everything.
Now, we’ve been saying that this show in Berlin happened to be a particularly notable night for you to commemorate on the CD/DVD set, but what have been some of your other favorite destinations to tour in the past?
All over the world was a blast, we went everywhere from South America to Russia to Japan, and New Zealand, the fans have always been fanatical wherever we’ve gone, really. At the end of the day, we’re really just kind of in a building or in a field, so we enjoy it everywhere, really. I don’t think any of us have ever mentioned our favorite countries to play in. If the people cheered, we were quite happy with that. But everywhere was really good.
That’s awesome, and a great attitude to have towards it too, you give an equal experience to everyone, wherever you are.
Exactly, we’re just happy to get on stage and play.
Now, outside of this live Motörhead release, there’s plenty going on for your end of things as well, the best part about having a band called Phil Campbell and the Bastard Sons, is that it’s actually your sons. So how did that first come about, were you just like, “oh, it’d be fun to jam together”, or did you guys more formally plan out to actually start a band?
Well, we got together about 2 or 3 years before Motörhead finished. My eldest son turned 30, so we booked a venue for his party down in Wales, and obviously, we were all there as a family, and we had borrowed the band’s instruments, and my son’s friend, Neil Starr, who had his own band Dopamine, he was there, so we went up and did a few songs. That was fun, just some cover songs. Then we did a couple more gigs, I think we did one at Bloodstock Festival, and I was still playing with Motörhead then. We were called Phil Campbell’s All-Star Band, we couldn’t think of anything else then. Sadly, when Motörhead finished, when I had a chance to get over that, I had a lot more time on my hands. Then we decided to change our name and write some cool original material, and it kind of went on from there. We’ve done an EP and two albums now, and we’ve played stadiums supporting Guns ’n’ Roses, and lots of arenas and we’re building it up, you know. We’re playing bigger places up by us, with ourselves headlining now, you know? It’s great fun. My kids are amazing musicians, they’ve been in lots of other bands as well, great bands. But they’ve never gotten the recognition they deserve, so at least we’ve playing to respectable crowds now. We’re just looking forward to some shows happening now, maybe, and playing some of them songs from the last album for the first time. Because we had 13 original songs from the last album we put out in November, but no shows yet, so we’re looking forward to doing some of them later this year.
You mentioned the Bloodstock Festival, and I saw that you guys are planning on playing some festivals this summer, Bloodstock being one of them, Steelhouse is another, and honestly, that’s great news to see that some shows are being scheduled, and so far, planning to go on.
Yeah, we just got two or three festivals in the summer booked in the UK, and a UK tour we’ve got booked for November. We already had to cancel all of last year, like most artists. We had our busiest year last year as well, we were going to be busy for nine months out of the year basically, and we didn’t do anything *laughs*. We did an album though, we wrote and recorded, thank god we did that, otherwise it would have been a complete write-off. We recorded, wrote, and released a new album, so we’ll see, yeah. Bloodstock’s not til the end of August, I think there’s a couple of other festivals in July, maybe, so fingers crossed. We’ll have to wait and see, as soon as everyone gets vaccinated, the sooner we can get back to normal.
We’ve all been holding our breath waiting for live shows to come back again, and now there’s some positive signs that they might actually be here later this year. Definitely exciting to think of the prospect of everything kind of going back to normal.
Yeah, another full year without it is too much to comprehend really, isn’t it? Everything has dragged on for everyone. We need some good news now.
You also mentioned that you recorded the new album last year, so you were obviously in a lockdown type of situation, how did that change your approach to recording? Or did it not affect you much?
We wrote it in January and February, not knowing it was going to be a lockdown in March, we had a few ideas in from soundchecks last year, and Todd wrote a bunch of songs, ready to present to the band, and I had a few as well. So we got the album ready to record by the end of February, really, and then March became the big lockdown. But luckily, we’ve got our own studio, close to where we live, we own a studio. So we were just going in and taking it in turns with Todd, socially distanced, doing it bit by bit like that. It was done in a way with no pressure on us, no deadline as such. Our plan before any lockdown or anything, like the previous year, was to get a new album out in 2020, so it didn’t affect us in that way. Only the lack of gigs, of course. But it was good for the album, we could take our time and everything. So we were really pleased with the album in the end, I think it’s a belter of an album.
It sounds awesome, and it’s great because it’s really a rock and roll album and band, first and foremost, but you’ve got some blues mixed in there, a touch of metal, mostly heavy rock, so it seems like a great balance of everything. What were some ideas that went into the new Phil Campbell and the Bastard Sons record?
The different generation helps as well. Me being the older generation, and the other boys being in their 30’s, the influences all of us are bringing to the table, you sometimes can’t really put your finger on different things, but we like to think that we know good music. We just try and put it all together to make good songs, at the end of the day. We didn’t actually say this time, “we’re going to do a metal album” or “we’re going to do a blues album”, we just tried to get a bunch of really good songs together. And it turned out great. Over the moon with it, great production, Todd did a brilliant job producing and everything. I’m glad you like it, lots of people have told me it’s a scorcher of a record. We just want to play the damn songs live!
Exactly, that’s what we’ve got to focus on next!
It’s killing us! *laughs*
It sounds like you have a lot of great stuff going on with that band, I’m sure it must be fun keeping it in the family, the music bug that you had, you passed it on, so that’s good. And the Motörhead live release, like I said, is great for everyone to experience some of those memories with you, of past tours and whatever future releases you have coming out, we’re all looking forward to that as well.
Ah, that’s brilliant.
So let’s wrap things up with what’s next for Phil Campbell?
Just waiting to do some shows, I think, and maybe some recording next year. We’ll wait and see, but we’re itching to do the shows now.
Well, we’re all itching to go to them, so let’s all keep our positive energy up and hope that they’re coming soon.
Ministry just unleashed a new album with Moral Hygiene, the fifteenth of the band’s discography. I recently had a chance to talk with Al Jourgensen about what fueled the ideas of the new record, forming a new lineup and recording during the pandemic, and more.
Photo Credit: Derick Smith
I have so much to say and ask you about Moral Hygiene, but I’ve got to start somewhere, so I want to start with “Alert Level”, obviously an awesome track that hits hard right off the bat, and of course you’ve got the lyric video for it out already. Can you talk about what went into this opener for the album?
Yeah, that was the first song that we started recording literally a couple of weeks pre-quarantine, like a couple of weeks before March. So it’s been a while, and it was basically about what we can do as a society to protect our planet so we have a planet to live in – ie., climate change, et cetera. And we did the song and we were just like, “wow, this actually came out really good”, and then quarantine hit. And we didn’t know if there was going to be record labels…a society *laughs*…movies, all releases were shut down. So we made a point to get that one out first as opposed to just waiting around for the rest of the record to get out and all that, we were like, we don’t even know if there’s a future. At least release that so we can have our say-so in it.
Yeah, that’s pretty wild you had that all queued up and ready to go, getting ready to make more music and all of a sudden the world just shuts down, it’s like, what the hell happened, man?
It’s been a crazy year.
Exactly, but things are starting to look up a little bit, you’ve got Moral Hygiene on the way this fall, and another track that you released to the world recently is “Good Trouble”. You released a social media only version, and that’s a really cool approach when for the past year everyone’s been on social media more than ever before, so it’s a unique way of sharing an extra bonus outside of the album.
Well, that’s the unfortunate circumstance of the society we live in today to where me and my friend, Arabian Prince from NWA, decided he would read the words of John Lewis posthumously, on something that he thought really long and hard about and didn’t say while he was alive, although he lived what he said when he was alive. But he said it, and it was put in succinct terms after he died, and I thought that was spectacular, and so did Arabian Prince, so we both said we’re going to do a song that’s worthy of this man and this movement. I think we pulled it off, but then the labels get all concerned that we couldn’t get ahold of John Lewis’ representatives to say, “it’s okay, you have a clearance to do this”, and so they said, “no, you have to edit it out on the album”, because they were all afraid of lawsuits. This is the society that we’ve created, nobody can do art anymore without really expressive constrictions that are going on. So that kind of pissed me off, so we released it in social media in its full form because no money is to be made by it, it’s just on our social medias. And I really urge fans to go and get that one out – that video is poignant and important toward relations of the human species in the future. I mean, I really think John Lewis has been onto something for over 50, 60 years, and it’s about time that he was credited. Because Ministry has always just been known as badmouthing political figures, you know? *laughs*
*laughs* You have a point.
And now we’re honoring somebody, but I don’t consider him a political figure, I consider him an activist and a true human world citizen.
And I actually didn’t realize all the mechanics going into something like that, not putting it on the album because of other representatives being involved, that makes the social media version make a lot of sense. It feels like social media has become such a platform for artists to express themselves beyond constrictions like you were saying.
I just think that social media has become…and I have a song that touches on it on Moral Hygiene, called “Disinformation”. Social media and the internet were supposed to be like the renaissance of information, and it’s just devolved into disinformation by corporate greed, it’s just a cesspool. So you take your chances. It’s almost like you have a better chance of winning the lotto than doing something really productive and good musically, putting it out, and having someone not pick it apart because of political things or whatever, you know what I mean? You get caught in this cross-trap of disinformation and pretty soon you’re like, is this all worth it? But, yes, it is. We’ve just got to persevere and hopefully cooler heads will prevail in Washington someday – doubtful, but maybe. That artists can tour again, and people get vaccinated and they can go see concerts and go to restaurants and movies, and this and that, and the entertainment business makes a comeback. Because right now, just as when the streaming services happened, the music industry was completely caught off guard and they didn’t know what to do. The eventual deals that were struck between the streaming services and the labels, the only people that didn’t make any money or anything was the artist. Everyone else still had their share, but it just stomped the artist down, and now with this new age of social media disinformation, it’s even worse. Some people prosper but like I said, it’s like the lotto. Some people go viral – for no apparent reason, just because it’s the flavor of the week and they’re the new, biggest thing, and they really have put nothing into the art community, but yet they’re the hugest thing in the world right now. And I don’t blame them, I just blame the system for what’s propagating what we listen to and what our culture and arts are right now.
And what you mentioned about the streaming platforms, of course, that’s something very prevalent, and a lot of artists are trying to fight that system now – like the deals where the artist gets half of a half of a penny for each stream.
But you know what? The whole mainstream media places it at the feet of the artists, like we’re just greedy artists, we want more mansions and this and that. More yachts, blah blah. It’s like, no, you have to remember, man. There’s entire roadcrews, there’s personnel at every venue in the United States, that rely on the music industry. These are working class people, so you could put it in a nice little bag with a giftwrap and say it’s just “artists’ greed”, but no, it’s corporate greed. Because the artists are struggling to survive at this point. I mean, literally, we’ve done congressional measures for first responders and people that work in grocery stores and movie theaters, anything. First line contact, but they don’t have any rules yet for the music industry. And this is what’s perplexing to me because culture doesn’t grow without art, any society doesn’t grow without art. You look at all the great societies of our time, from the Greek and Roman and everything, and the artists were well-paid in the sense of, they propagated culture to what we wanted to advance to. They propagated human dreams. And human dreams are being shut out by the corporate greed that’s happened through this pandemic. If you notice, most people are broke yet people are sending…space dicks, into space, and making money off this. The economic inequality is stunning. And we forget how important the arts are, it’s the first thing they cut out in high school curriculum – they always keeps sports because sports makes money. And I understand that, but the arts – and for example, civics classes have not been a thing for 20-30 years. They cut that out so we’re not able to understand our government and how it functions, and how you can make it function better. All these things are just like, it’s so depressing.
There’s so much to address in what you said, but I agree that when music and arts are so essential to society, it’s definitely crazy that artists have been struggling for this past year, and there doesn’t seem to be any clear path to getting out of that. I’ve been seeing various charities popping up, Live Nation did something, Sweet Relief has been raising money for musicians and road crews, and things like that. But it’s been a very strange and rough year for the music industry for sure.
Well, the entire entertainment industry, I mean, look at movies. Literally, I’m pretty sure that the only movies we have coming out over the next few years are either really depressing things that show the real condition – like Father or Nomadland or something – or just Marvel comics. That’s it, that’s what people want to see. So where does that leave us as artists in the musical variety? It really confuses people. So we just got to keep putting one foot in front of the other and hopefully people realize that art and culture progresses society in a way that legislation can’t even do. If the art is sincere, people will think differently if they enjoy the art that’s being given to them about the legislation that’s occurred. It’s really all hand-in-hand, it’s kind of like an ecosystem, I think the whole ecobalance of artistic ingenuity has been thrown off balance in this society, and I think it needs to get back to that.
I think, in terms of your music, you’re very authentic, you definitely say what’s on your mind and put it into the music, so in that way, you’re contributing to what you want to see happen. That sense of putting one foot in front of another, putting your own message out there and hoping it reaches where it needs to reach.
Yeah. And you know, if it was shit, I wouldn’t mind if people just went, “yeah, whatever”. But, I honestly…you may say this is pompous, but I think my music’s important and I think the things that we have to say as the band, under the brand Ministry, is basically where every couple of years, we put out a record, and it’s a wake-up call, like this is the blueprint on what’s gone wrong and maybe how we can fix it.
I don’t think it sounds pompous, I think you should be sure of your art, when you’re going to release something, you want to be standing behind it and believing in what you’re saying.
Thank you, that’s all I’ve got to say, thank you. *laughs*
Of course. So, when you say “we, as the band Ministry”, you do have a recently new lineup, and it’s a mix of some long-term members, and some brand-new ones. Getting a band together during a pandemic is probably something pretty challenging, so how did this new band that you have lined up for the fall tour all line up in your life?
Well, of course, I mean, we were all double-vaxxed and masked. And then we decided in my studio what fits and what doesn’t. But it was a weird extra component towards making art, this health requirement. It was really strange. But either way, I think we put the perfect band together for this, I don’t know if there will ever be a better band for Ministry than, I believe it was 2008 with Joey Jordison, myself, and Mike Scaccia, Paul Raven – all those three are deceased – John Bechdel, that was really a rock band, okay? So this is a little bit different, but I think that the potential for this band on this upcoming tour is astounding. I think we found the right build of personalities, talent, and taste that we’ll make this a really good tour.
That’s awesome, and really exciting as well. You did have some guests besides the new band, of course you mentioned the team-up with Arabian Prince, and I love that you covered The Stooges on the album, and you also got Billy Morrison involved with that. So how did you guys go about reworking that song to give it the Ministry touch?
Well, that’s kind of a long story if you’ve got a minute. So, Dave Navarro of Jane’s Addiction, et cetera, and Billy Morrison put together this band and this wonderful benefit for a wonderful cause called Above Ground, basically focusing on teenage suicide, “keep them above ground”. And also basically focusing on LGBTQ communities, and why people commit suicide due to the social media onslaught, and this and that. So they decided they’d put together a band, Dave and Billy, and they got some guest singers to sing on two albums that they were going to focus on, a David Bowie album, and an Iggy one. And on the Iggy album, they called me and they thought I was the right representative for Iggy because I’ve worked with Iggy before, and I’ve known Iggy for 35 years. So we went to soundcheck, and I did the two songs I was supposed to do, and then we went backstage and then backstage – I will tell you this right now, a lesson learned in life, man…never accept a joint from a stranger.
Uh-oh.
…Done. *laughs* Yeah. So about twenty minutes before I was supposed to go on, a joint was being passed around backstage, and listen – I’m a heavy marijuana smoker, I enjoy the benefits of cannabis immensely, as well as psilocybin, that’s the only drugs I do anymore, that’s it. I’m pretty well legal within American constraints, but I decided to take a hit off this joint, and everything went under water. So I went onstage, and I sang “Search and Destroy”, basically in half-time. Because a lot of people have covered “Search and Destroy”, a lot of bands, and they try and do it like the original. This was not like the original because I was singing it in half-time and underwater. So the next day, I woke up, and I called Dave and I called Billy and apologized profusely for me screwing up their entire event and this and that, and I was seriously just freaked out at how bad this was. And they went, “No. This is it, this is the way this song needs to be done! That was actually the way to do it, so let’s go to your studio and record this tomorrow”. That was actually one of the first songs we did on this record, but I didn’t want to put it on the record until I actually contacted Iggy and made sure he heard it and gave it a thumbs up, which he did. So yeah, there it is.
That’s definitely quite the story, but awesome that it got the thumbs up from Iggy, wherever it came from *laughs*. Now, you recorded Moral Hygiene in your own studio, so can you talk a bit about your home studio setup?
As far as what was done in the studio over the last year, not only was Moral Hygiene done, but ten songs were recorded for a new Lard record, which Jello Biafra is sitting on right now, singing in his own studio in San Francisco. So it’s more like the next two albums that come out are like Zoom albums, during the quarantine. You get your stuff, you mail a hard drive, they mail stuff back, you mail stuff back, and that’s the new way to do it. And that’s fine! I’m willing to adapt. Human beings are always good at adapting, so we got an entire Lard record done, and we also got an entire new Ministry record done, where the only thing missing is my vocals. I’m very persnickety about the message I want to send and the vocals that I do, so I didn’t find that I had it in me to sing on these songs, but the songs are not any less than the songs on Moral Hygiene. If anything, I think they might be better, but I didn’t have it in me at that time to come up with topics for those particular songs. So it’s an ongoing process, but during the quarantine, I basically recorded three albums.
That’s amazing, and to know that there’s already more Ministry on deck, when we’re just kind of digesting this one now, there’s more on the horizon.
That’s a good way to put it. Let’s dissect this one, then let’s see the next. And I think the next will pretty much end the dissection, you’ll pretty much know where I’m at. *laughs*
That’s exciting though, that’s the thing, quarantine has been really weird for the music industry, but it has given some artists a lot of additional time to dig in and write more music, since you haven’t been on the road, might as well just get in studio and knock out a bunch of stuff.
Right, exactly, and I hope they used their time wisely. Because that was literally a wasted year for 75% of the population of the globe, and I think 25% really took advantage of the world’s time out, which I think was actually necessary. As you see hiring patterns now amongst businesses that are starting up, people are going, “You know what? I never liked that job. Screw it. Maybe I can do something on my own, do my own startup or something, I don’t need to be working for this fascist company to make billions of dollars for the owner while I’m paid minimum wage”. And they’re just all like whatever, man. And now only that, the earth actually healed for a year – everything from carbon emissions to ozone, healed over a year. It just shows what a year of being sensible would look like to the future of humanity. I think there was a lot of good things – obviously, not the deaths and needless deaths. Some deaths will occur of course, but the needless deaths, and these people have dreams, lives, and families, and they’re dead now because they listened to political disinformation. It’s really sad, the state of where our society has gotten to right now.
It’s definitely double-sided, everything that’s happened over the past year. I do agree that you can see a few positive changes – the earth in general, people’s attitudes toward work, toward realizing how valuable it is that they got to spend time at home with family and realizing they have to prioritize that more – and then of course from the music side, for the artists – so I suppose there’s always a few positives to be pulled from any situation.
Chelsea, that’s very astute, but you missed out on the biggest point of all – Britney is going to be free soon. *laughs* When I heard that I was like, “oh my god, finally, some GOOD gossip”. *laughs* And trust me, that was completely dripped and coated in sarcasm. I don’t give a shit, but I’ll tell you what. It was fun watching, because pandemic news has been different than other years’ news, mainstream media has adapted and we’ve all adapted to how we view things and how we go about our lives thanks to this pandemic. And I mean literally, thanks, there’s a lot of things that I think are going to be positives when we’re done with this trial – I call it a trial of humanity. I think there’s a lot of positives coming, so I’m actually becoming a glass half-full as opposed to a glass half-empty guy, and Britney’s freedom of course, that would just be the cherry on the sundae.
*laughs* Well, in terms of some other positives, everybody’s looking forward to seeing Ministry get back out there on the road for the tour this fall. We’ve been focusing on Moral Hygiene, of course, but your upcoming tour is also featuring The Mind Is A Terrible Thing To Taste, for the 30th Anniversary, and that’s obviously so iconic of an album, you’re heading out in October with Helmet, Front Line Assembly, so it sounds like a lot of cool stuff going on for this tour.
Well, we’re going to do a couple of Moral Hygiene songs on this tour, just to introduce them to people, and we’ll do 5 or 6 from The Mind Is A Terrible Thing To Taste, and recreate the original set that’s on “In Case You Didn’t Feel Like Showing Up”, with the chainlink fence and all that. And so it should be an interesting tour with a lineup that I’m really, really proud of. And then, who knows? Like I said, we have two albums coming out within the next two years of brand-new stuff done during quarantine. So we’ll have to figure out a new approach depending on health restrictions and this and that, whatever’s going on. I just have my fingers crossed that October can happen – I’m double-vaxxed by the way, I fully support it, and listen – nobody, nobody in this world has been as fully adamant about distrusting government as Ministry and myself. But, it’s not about government, it’s about science, and we can help our society continue as a society, or even a semblance of it, if you just get vaccinated. I’m on the full-on, just go get vaxxed, just get us back to…well, I don’t want to say “get us back to normal”, let’s get us to the point where we can propagate a new normal that’s better than the old normal.
“A new normal that’s better than the old normal”, sounds like a good note to end it on. It’s hard to say right now exactly what’s going to be happening in October, but there’s a lot of plans in the works and it looks like things are heading in the direction of opening back up and getting to shows again, so hopefully it happens, and I’m looking forward to seeing you out on tour.
Like I said, fingers crossed, man. That’s all we can do at this point, just fingers crossed and just do what’s right for you, your neighbors and the community. And thank you so much, Chelsea, you take care.
Absolutely, thank you so much for your time today, Al.
Motörhead is set to release a new boxset this fall with Everything Louder Forever, the definitive collection of 42 of their loudest ever songs, representing every era of the band’s recorded history all in one set. The release will be available in many forms, including 2CD, 2LP, 4LP, digital download, streaming and 360 Reality Audio. The 2CD digipak and 4LP fold out sets will feature 42 tracks, including “Ace Of Spades”, “Killed By Death”, “Overkill”, “I’m So Bad (Baby I Don’t Care)”, “The Game” and many more. The 2LP set will include 22 tracks in a gatefold package.
This week, to preview the upcoming release, Motörhead has revealed an upgraded music video for the track “Rock Out”, on which they comment, “One of the finest tracks from #EverythingLouderForever is ‘Rock Out’ and to celebrate we’ve had the video restored and upgraded to 4K HD. ‘Rock Out’ appears on the album ‘Motörizer’ and features the line-up of Lemmy, Phil Campbell, and Mikkey Dee. Originally released on 26th August 2008 on SPV, it was produced by Cameron Webb”. Check out the video below.
Everything Louder Forever will be out on October 29th via BMG Records. You can preorder the album with exclusive merch bundles, and keep an eye out for news and updates via: https://imotorhead.com/everything-louder-forever/.
August Burns Red has kept busy throughout lockdown, with three releases out over the course of the past year – Guardians, Guardians Sessions EP, and Leveler 10th Anniversary Edition. I had the chance to speak with guitarist JB Brubaker about the latest recordings and releases in the August Burns Red world, his pandemic experience, their recent breakaway to being a self-produced/self-released band, signature guitars and gear preferences, and more. Check it out below.
JB Brubaker of August Burns Red with his signature Ibanez JBBM30 guitar. Photo by Clinton Tustin.
So first off, how have things been for you and your family, handling everything that’s been going on for the past year?
You know, we’re making it through, I guess, it’s been a challenge as for many people. One of the challenges, without getting too deep right off the bat, but my wife and I have only known each other through me being on the road. So, coming home for a year and a half straight is just an adjustment for both of us just for the lifestyle we’re used to, and we have a small child, so we’ve been doing a lot of co-parenting, which is different for me. Because I’m used to being the career guy, going out and working. So a lot of adjustments, but we’re making it through and trying to make the best of the situation.
I’m sure that is an adjustment, especially for touring musicians in general, it’s a huge adjustment to be like, “oh, I’ve got to stay home now, what? This is weird”.
Yeah, definitely weird. I think both my wife and I miss the “normalcy” we had, because it was comfortable for us, and I definitely miss playing shows and I can’t wait to just get back to that environment.
Everyone’s waiting for that environment to come back for sure. Regardless, August Burns Red, you’ve had three releases in the past year alone, Guardians, the Guardians Sessions EP, and now the Leveler10th Anniversary coming up, so no doubt the band has kept busy, I think.
When Guardians came out in April of 2020, we had this kind of feeling of like, almost defeat. Like, we just put this record out that we’re so pumped on, and can’t do anything with it. And we just sort of hibernated for a couple of months right there at the beginning of lockdown. Then we basically did a 180, we were like, “okay, this isn’t ending anytime soon, we need to come up with a plan to be an active band because this is what we do”. And then we just started cranking and we haven’t stopped, and we’re going to keep doing what we need to do to be an active band, whether or not we can be active on the road. We need to keep ourselves busy one way or another. So we’ve recorded a lot of stuff and we’re releasing a lot of stuff, we just want to keep doing our band, because it’s what we love to do.
So when Guardians came out, you said, it was April of 2020, so you had everything done basically, before the pandemic and lockdown happened, right?
Yeah, the record was done for a few months, we had that tour with Killswitch Engage that we only got to play two shows on before we had to come home because of the pandemic, and we had a great plan for the record that has gone away. But there are some things that are more important than August Burns Red’s touring schedule *laughs*. This is one of those.
But the touring schedule will come back around at some point, hopefully later this year.
Yeah, it will.
So you also have the 10th Anniversary of Leveler this year, how does it feel to be looking back on that album? Because it wasn’t your first album, it was your fourth, so August Burns Red had already been going for a while by then, but you were still pretty new as compared to now. So while rerecording the tracks, did you find yourself reflecting on experience since then in the band?
Yeah, totally. Just looking back at the songs for what they were, I mean, reflecting on the songs, reflecting on where we were at as a band and our relationships as bandmates, a lot has changed since then. In 2011, 2012, when we were on the Leveler tour, we were going through a lot of growing pains as a band, and just understanding each other as individuals and working on internal conflicts and stuff that are inevitable when you spend so much time together in very tight places and traveling a lot. And on that touring cycle, I think we played over 40 countries or something ridiculous, we toured really aggressively on that record.
Wow! 40 countries, you covered a lot of ground there.
*laughs* Yeah, it sounds daunting to be thinking back on it, we definitely haven’t been that ambitious since. And honestly, it was probably a little bit too much, because it put a lot of strain on our internal relationships, but, it also taught us how to work through problems and understand each other more, and I think that that conflict we experienced then has helped us to be really stable as we came out of the weeds. And at this point, ten years later, we’re stronger than ever internally in how we get along, and we’re all on the same page working toward the same goal, there’s no individual ego, we’re all in it together for the common good. So I’m really proud of what we’ve been able to accomplish since this record came out. And then more so on the musical side of things, I’m really proud of being able to dissect these songs from Leveler, and be able to give them sort of a modern facelift from the original recording. The production’s way better, we were able to do more with guitar solos and we brought in guest musicians that we weren’t able to do the first time around. And I think for fans of the original, it’s going to be a new experience, and I think for people who haven’t heard the record at all, it’ll be an opportunity to share the album with them and have them hear it like it’s a new, modern release.
That’s awesome, and really great to hear about how tight the ties are between you guys in the band are now, just from what you’re saying, it sounds like you’ve grown over the years, and that’s great to hear from a band that works as hard as you guys for as long as you have.
Thank you.
So how did you initially approach the decision to re-record in general? What did you do in terms of going back and listening, deciding what felt like it needed an update, things like that?
Our bass player, Dustin, and I handle the majority of the songwriting at this point, so we basically just pulled up all the original guitar tabs that we had written for that album, and combed each song carefully, changed the tunings, we tuned everything down a little bit lower than the original recordings as metal music just has gotten lower and heavier over the last 10 years. And then we rewrote solos and various guitar leads here and there, and then added a lot of pads and sort of ethereal textures underneath various riffs to kind of give the record a more dynamic vibe overall. We approached it the way we would approach a record that we were writing now. We know a lot more than we did when we were writing back in 2010. So basically, gave it the modern August Burns Red facelift.
Of course – that makes sense, you’ve learned a lot over the years, and what you said about the downtuning and giving it an even more modern metal sound – I think for a lot of metal fans, they understand a lot about the music but may not be musicians themselves, and may not even necessarily recognize something like tuning down and how much heavier or darker it can sound without that insight. I think that’s cool that you guys went in and provided that modern metal sound that people will recognize, even if they’re not sure exactly what created it, you know?
Right, totally, I agree. We are just in this really unique position right now where we’re in between record labels, we’re out of a contract right now, so we’re free to do whatever we want. That is something we’ve never been…we haven’t been “free agents” since, like, 2005. So we wanted to take this opportunity where we’re all kind of stuck at home anyway, and focus on studio projects, because we’re able to do that anyway, and self-release if we want, which we are doing with the Leveler10th Anniversary Edition.
Cool, yeah, I mean, you guys have been signed to labels for a long time, because you had Solid State for years before, and Fearless Records for years now, so I guess it is kind of the first time you’re out and exploring on your own a bit there.
Yeah, it’s really weird, but if we had to be in that position, I’m glad it was during the pandemic, when we were at home, and able to spend a lot of time with our music.
Because that way you don’t have pressures and deadlines and things, you’re like, “let’s just see what happens!”
Exactly! I love that.
You’ve also got a Leveler livestream coming up, and you guys have been doing playthroughs and things like that for all of this time, you’ve been keeping active on social media, keeping the fans engaged and everything. Is this the first actual full concert livestream you’re doing?
It’s actually our third, we did two at the end of last year, in November we did one for the 15th Anniversary of our record Thrill Seeker, which was our first record that we put out. And then around the holidays, we did one for Christmas. We play an annual Christmas show and we couldn’t do one this year, so we decided to do that online. But it’s going to be a good six months since we did anything, so we’re really excited to play together again. We have a really ambitious show planned out, both in the amount of songs and material we’re going to be performing, and I guess the sheer size of the production we’re trying to do. So hopefully it comes out the way we envision it, I think it’s going to be a really fun August Burns Red show even though people can’t watch us in person.
That’s the thing with the livestreams, everyone needs to make it bigger and better, I think, is how a lot of bands are feeling, because you don’t have that in-person energy and experience, so it’s more of a visual and audio thing, like “how big can we make this that it still feels almost live?”
Right, that’s the goal, and it’s definitely a challenge, but it also opens up possibilities for us to do things – like, what we have planned for the Leveler livestream is something that we could never take on the road for the size of band we are. It only works in this one-off sort of environment, so I’m excited at the prospect to do something bigger than we could typically do on a regular tour date.
So that will be some interesting surprises for fans in that case – what, are we going to have like an Iron Maiden Eddie-style big August Burns Red mascot coming out?
*laughs* Well, you’ll just have to wait and see, I don’t want to give anything away.
Of course *laughs*.
There will be no Iron Maiden characters coming on stage though, I can say that much.
*laughs* I also wanted to ask about the Guardians Sessions EP, that was another lockdown release. Was it just something that came up for you guys during lockdown to go back and revisit some things, do some B sides, covers, things like that?
Yeah, definitely a product of us having time on our hands. We had a couple of songs that were unreleased from Guardians that we wanted to put out, but we didn’t really want to release them just as singles. So we took advantage of our downtime and did a couple acoustic reworking of songs from Guardians, and then did a couple covers for fun just for us. I started with a cover of the Westworld theme song, probably back in 2018, and I never got to finish it because I was just too busy with more pressing material. But as soon as we got sent home, that was the first thing I did. And I actually spent a lot of time finishing that cover. And then, we realized we had a fair amount of material and it made sense to do an EP, instead of just releasing it all at once, we thought it would be fun to just slow release one song at a time. I think we did seven songs over seven months, starting last October. Which was cool, we’ve never done anything like that before, and I think it was fun for fans to just get that steady stream of new material.
Absolutely, it gives you something to look forward to, especially when you know it’s on a monthly basis, you’re getting something new from August Burns Red. Was that one also self-released, self-produced?
No, this one was with Fearless, it was our last. It just happened to fall under the time when we were still under contract, but Fearless was fully behind it, and did an awesome job helping us to create and market the record. Happy to have them on the team for this release.
And you also had, for years on Fearless, this producing team of Carson [Slovak] and Grant [McFarland] for many of the albums, so was that anything tied to Fearless, or will you still be working with them after, do you think?
We actually started working with them – our last record with Solid State was also produced by Carson and Grant, they’re long-time friends of the band, and there’s just an understanding between us. We really get how they work and they get how we work, and they’re local to us, which is nice, because a bunch of us have families now, and it’s difficult to be – I mean, not in 2020, since we weren’t touring – but, typically if we’re on the road, we don’t want to then come home from a six-week tour and fly to LA for six weeks to make a record, like that just doesn’t work with our lives right now. So it works well to work with Carson and Grant and we can treat it as a day job where we usually work 10am to 6pm, like a normal kind of workday. And then we go home end can be parents and whatever we need to be for our families.
Yeah, that’s convenient, but funny, because no one ever really thinks of music, especially metal, as a 9-to-5 style job, so that’s funny you guys were able to work it out like that.
It definitely wasn’t in our 20’s, but now that we’re in our 30’s, things are a little more regimented *laughs*.
Of course! You’ve got to adjust and balance everything as you go along. So I also wanted to talk about gear a little bit, I believe I saw you were endorsed by Ibanez for guitars, but other than that, what are some favorite go-tos for gear in general, whether it’s Ibanez or otherwise?
Yeah, I play Ibanez guitars and I actually have a new signature model coming out this year through Ibanez, it’s a black guitar with white stripes, I had one previously that was green with white stripes for anyone who knows anything about that – so if you know anything about guitar, and you’re interested in that sort of thing, keep an eye out, it should be out shortly. I play Fractal Audio Axe Effects for my amps, just a digital amp processor, and I’m literally standing in my studio right now looking at my pedalboard, I don’t know how in-depth you want me to go *laughs*.
However in-depth you feel like, man! It’s all good.
Cool. Well, one thing I guess that’s cool about what I’m doing right now is, we have a lot of different tunings during our songs, and rather than play four different guitars during a set, I use a pedal called a drop pedal that a company called DigiTech makes, and it basically allows me to drop the pitch of my guitar without actually changing the tuning of the guitar, which makes it really easy to play live in lots of different settings without having to switch guitars constantly. Really handy when traveling overseas, this one, so you don’t have to haul around four different instruments. I don’t know, technology’s crazy, it’s crazy to think how much gear we used to haul around to make our sound, and now we’re playing out of these little computers, basically, that do everything in one small box, it’s wild.
No, absolutely, it’s so crazy. And there’s new things coming out every day with audio processing, digital, everything you can do where you’re still the one physically playing the guitar, but so much is happening in these digital plugins and processors that transforms it into something completely different. It’s really cool, actually. And I’m sure people, during the pandemic, have had time to develop even more.
For real! I just know for myself and my band, we’re done a lot with home studio stuff in just the last year, because we’ve had the time and we’re stuck at home, so we’re trying to step up our home audio game.
And I’m sure when you have – like you said earlier – labels involved, and there’s deadlines and whatever, you probably find a sound and you’re like, “Okay, this is cool, we’ll stick with it”, but I’m sure if you’re experimenting at home, you have more time to be like, “What would happen if I used *this* pedal or *this* plugin instead”?
Absolutely, we can try out so much more at home before we get into the actual studio with our producers, which is a big win for everyone, really.
Well, like you said, you guys have been keeping super active for the past year, and it’s definitely great for the August Burns Red fanbase out there that’s looking for new stuff from you guys, so it’s cool you’ve been keeping up with it. The livestream is definitely something to look forward to, so other than that – do you have any ideas on what’s next on the plate for August Burns Red, or are you just going to hang out for a while and wait for shows to come back?
Well, we have aspirations to tour in the fall, we are confirmed on a bunch of festivals that have been announced, so we’ll just have our fingers crossed that we can play again, because that’s what our hope is, and that’s the hope of the fans as well. So hopefully people get vaccinated and we can get back to playing again before long.
Well, thanks so much for taking the time to talk with me today, JP, it’s been really cool talking with you and getting to know more about you and your gear and lifestyle and everything. Best of luck with everything!
Veil of Maya dropped their latest single “Viscera” earlier this year, and the band is on the way to releasing a new album. I had the chance to speak with guitarist Marc Okubo about the new Veil of Maya tracks and upcoming record, his lockdown experience, his work with other bands including Dance Gavin Dance, the partnership with Kiesel Guitars, and more. Check it out below.
First of all, how have things been for you handling everything that’s been going on for the past year?
Well, I’m up and down. I’m in Los Angeles right now writing and recording a new album for the band, so that’s been very fun and happy. But when I was by myself in Chicago, it got kind of dark for a while. It was kind of hard to see what the future state of music was going to be like when it was first going down. But all the time away from it kind of made me realize what I enjoy about it. It kind of took the job aspect away from it, and now I feel like a little kid again, music’s gotten a little bit more magic to me.
Yeah, it was definitely weird in the beginning for everyone, because with things shutting down, we didn’t know when the hell we were getting back to a show again, some bands kept on pushing through and releasing music, others came to a halt, it was definitely a weird time, but I’m glad to hear it was kind of a good transition for you in a way and you were able to rediscover some of your roots with music. At the end of the day, it was probably productive for you in a way.
Yeah, mentally, I needed it overall. It had just been so long since…I mean, there’s no way to get a break that long from anything. We’d just be on tour all year, and by the end of it — I guess it’s weird because going to shows and seeing how others bands are doing and interacting with everyone was how I would get inspired to create before, and not having that suddenly hit. Now creating music is just purely fun, it’s just more for me now than it is thinking about what our fans are going to think.
That aspect of it is awesome, that you got to reconnect with your love of music in that way. Of course, the single “Viscera” is the latest we’ve heard from Veil of Maya, and honestly, one new single alone has people going crazy to hear new Veil of Maya. It’s charting high, it’s doing great, so maybe start off talking about what went into that track.
The track was mostly written in 2019, I was at a different studio on the East Coast and things kind of stopped and didn’t really work out in that studio, so I actually was mailed a hard drive with all of our sessions for our songs on it, and that is one of the ones where I took what we had and finished it, rewrote a few parts. Our drummer recorded the drums during the pandemic in his little practice studio, he did that himself. Then we just sent off the tracks to our friend to mix it, and it worked out really well, actually. To be honest, I would rather not have an animated video, I’d rather have a real one, but at least we’ve got something out for it.
Yeah, absolutely. And you did have a music video last year, for “Outsider”, the other new single, and I noticed when I was looking at the music video on YouTube, it makes a very specific point of noting that it was filmed March 10th, 2020, so you guys just made it with that, getting in a new video before lockdown.
Oh yeah, we intentionally put the date on there and everything because the official pandemic starting date was the 11th, which is actually my birthday, but then we had the first show of our tour with Dance Gavin Dance and Animals As Leaders was the 12th, so we’re all at the venue, it’s a sold out show, and then their manager comes in like, “Yep, tour’s cancelled. Everyone go home…indefinitely”. It was just a really weird experience.
So you were actually at the venue to play the show that night, did you get to play that one show and then the rest of the show got cancelled, or…?
No, all the bands just showed up and then, I guess we had kind of a little…we ate together, and we had kind of like a little party I guess, but it started raining outside and then everyone just went home.
We’ve all been kind of hearing that there’s another Veil of Maya album in the works to follow “Viscera”, and then of course, you just mentioned you’re in LA doing that now, so what’s the status of the album right now?
Okay, the “Outsider” and “Viscera” were part of the sessions I was doing on the East Coast, so we have essentially an album’s worth of material that we recorded then. And I honestly wanted to ditch the rest of that material, and come to Los Angeles and start fresh again. So either way, we’ll probably have like two albums’ worth of songs to pick from, but I’ll just take the best of the best and then that will end up being the new album. I just kind of had a bad taste in my mouth from the whole last experience, and this time I’m much more into what we’re doing. So if people like those songs, I can always say, just expect the next batch to be, like, prime. Because I’m stoked on what we’re doing now.
Nice. That’s cool, I mean, there’s always the option of a double album or something, throw all the tracks you’re not so hot about on the second one, like B-sides.
Yeah, yeah, exactly. It couldn’t hurt just to have more material, and since I think the progress of those two songs alone have paid off all the debt that was owed for recording in 2019, so we’re all good now to keep moving forward.
Now, being that there was a few years between the last record, False Idol, and this one that you guys are working on now, what made you feel like it was the right time to start working on something new?
Well, we’ve been a band for a long time, and I’m the main music writer in the band, and it just became a lot of pressure on me mentally to have material ready, and then also tour all year, and also helping write with other bands, and helping tour with other bands, and just managing life and relationships and all that just started becoming overwhelming. So, obviously I was trying my best, but I kind of lost that magic thing you have as an angsty teenager, I kind of lost that vibe for a little bit. And then this last year has kind of gotten it back in my system. Now, this is all for fun again, there’s no real work to it. It’s definitely hard to just keep on rushing things and having to meet expectations of being better than the last thing you put out, because you have less time to do it. But now I’ve had time to recollect, and I feel great.
That’s good. Of course, it’s definitely easy to get burned out doing too much of anything, but especially something so creative as writing music, you’re always trying to be original, trying to top what you did before with something new, I’m sure it can get exhausting, mentally and creatively.
Yeah, a lot of people don’t realize, when you release your first album and it’s super epic, and everyone wants new stuff coming out, a lot of times the band will have maybe 3-4 weeks to make a follow-up record, and that’s supposed to surpass their original one, which they had like their whole life to that point to make. It’s hard to explain to people that don’t have to do that, but that’s what happens, and then everyone gets mad at the second album, because it’s not as crazy as the first or whatever. There’s like a time limit now, for everything.
And that’s the thing, sometimes with songs, something epic can strike you like lightning and you’ll have it done in a day, and other times it just takes time and work, and I think a lot of bands, especially when you’re signed to a label, you have deadlines and everything, you don’t have all the time that you necessarily want. But I think that’s why the lockdown was, in a weird kind of way, good for a lot of musicians, because you had time to kind of recharge, like you said.
Yeah, it’s weird because, I also feel like as touring musician, we’re a little bit more well-equipped for situations like that, because we’re used to being gone for so long, and when you come back from touring, the world just keeps on going without you, so it’s everything all at once, and then nothing at all. So that nothing at all thing, pretty much everyone in the world had to feel together. But I’ve been doing it for years, and I knew how to handle it and kind of distract myself. Yeah, it’s rough watching the whole world deal with it, or watching celebrities have to make, like, crazy TikTok videos to get their normal focus of attention, or whatever.
Outside of that, a lot of bands have been trying to keep up with the fans just giving some kind of content, the livestream shows, Instagram playthroughs, whatever people need to do just to keep the fans interested, I guess.
And being honest, that’s just not really who I am. I do post online occasionally, but for most of last year, I deleted all the apps off my phone, because it got pretty hectic, and there’s a lot of drama about certain subjects, and I just didn’t want to be a part of that *laughs*. I had to focus on the things that were important to me. I don’t know, social media is a weird place right now.
It definitely is. So, back to band stuff, you mentioned that you do some things with other bands outside of Veil of Maya, and I saw that you recently did something with Dance Gavin Dance, right? So can you talk about that collaboration?
Yeah, that was amazing for me, honestly, because it made me feel…well, I’m really close with that band, so I was honored that they asked me to do that in the first place. But then having the song turn out well, it did a lot for my self-esteem where it’s just like, I’m not just limited to my band, and I’m a musician and producer, and there’s other things I could do and be helpful with. So it was good for me, and I hope I get more opportunities like that, where I can create music with other artists that sounds like them, and doesn’t sound like specifically what my band is.
Absolutely, kind of break out of the mold of your genre, there.
It’s funny, there’s a few other bands that I’ve written for but, it’s just funny watching people review and react to stuff on YouTube or wherever, where they’ll like, hate my band but then they’ll love another band’s song that I wrote. They just don’t realize that it’s all the same person doing specific things for other bands intentionally. Like, my band sounds like my band on purpose. If you hate it, that’s fine, but it’s not like that’s all we’re capable of doing.
Right, they didn’t do their research or look up who played guitar on the track.
No, I’m cool with that, that’s the way it should be, right?
Speaking of guitars, you mainly work with Kiesel guitars, so you had some signature models, so how did that partnership first come about?
I was introduced to Jeff Kiesel by Lee McKinney of Born of Osiris, and I think he was introduced to them by Rod from Volumes, it’s kind of like a little family tree. And then I actually introduced Jeff and Will from Dance Gavin Dance, so it’s like a big chain of homies who just all introduced each other.
That’s cool, and you also used to work with Jackson – so you’re mainly on Kiesel now, or do you balance out your gear with a little bit of everything?
I’m exclusively on Kiesel, and trying to sell my signature model guitar, but all that happened right before the lockdown thing, so it made it really hard for me to mentally be there to promote. I’m waiting for us to do this new album, so that I can make all these playthroughs, maybe release some solo material, more guitar-oriented music.
And since you have a signature guitar, and I think you’ve had a few in the past, I’m sure you probably frequent NAMM when that time comes around, did you make it to NAMM last year?
Yes, I did. That was my last performance as a musician actually.
Wow, you probably never expected that going in.
No, it was actually terrifying, because usually I have the support of my band behind me, at least, but there was a few booths full of people that were all probably like world-class musicians watching me, essentially naked *laughs*. I don’t know, it was just scary.
Yeah, NAMM is quite the experience, because it’s so weird, you’re surrounded by all of this music and all of this creativity, but at the end of the day, it’s literally a convention center with some booths. So it’s formal yet not at the same time.
Yeah, I would say it’s an essential party to experience if you’re in the music industry, it’s a lot of fun. And you end up knowing more people than you think.
So what’s some other go-to gear for you?
Well, I mean, essentially when I’m writing now, it’s all into the computer. So I use a program called Ableton Live, that’s how I write and record music. And then, I use programs like, there’s one called Superior Drummer, which is made by ToonTrack and they have cool-sounding drums so I can write drums. I use this program called Bias for guitars, other than that, pretty much my life is watching YouTube and watching tutorials, learning how to do new things.
So lots of digital then, DAWs and plugins is where your focus is.
Exactly, yeah.
You were talking about how during the lockdown, you returned to your roots and why you love music, feeling a little more connected with it, doing for the fun of it, which is awesome. So what about your pre-Veil of Maya life as a musician, what was the first thing that inspired you to get into music in general?
Oh, wow. That started from kind of being an angsty teenager, I guess. I grew up during, probably when I was like 10 or 11, Korn and Limp Bizkit kind of took over the world, and I wanted to go further than that, like “what’s harder than this?” and I got into Death Metal, and then I got into trying to see who the best musicians were, so I got into Fusion Jazz and Progressive Rock and all that. And I don’t know, I got sent away to a high school away from all my friends, so I ended up joining jazz band as something to do, and so I ended up just playing guitar all day for about a year. Yeah, then I just decided by about 14 or 15 that this is what I was going to do, no matter what happens, I’m going to figure it out.
I love how you felt like your taste needed to get progressively harder as you went along, you were like, “Korn? Not heavy enough, let’s go harder”. *laughs*
I mean, respect to them. They changed the world around me for sure, but I just kept on going, I kept on looking. I actually had a science teacher in 8th grade that saw me wearing a Soulfly shirt, and he was like “dude, you got to check out this other band, Sepultura”, and then he made me a mixtape that had Sepultura and Slayer on it, that was like a big eye-opening experience for me.
Oh, that’s awesome! You wouldn’t expect that from an 8th grade science teacher. That’s funny, I was once wearing an 80’s “Hair Metal” band t-shirt, a Europe t-shirt in one of my classes one time…
Nice!
…and the teacher actually made fun of me, he was like “Europe?! Oh my god, THOSE guys?” I’m like, “Yeah, they’re freakin cool, dude, what’s your problem!”
That rocks, actually. I threw up the metal horns.
Thanks! I guess you’re into the 80’s stuff too?
Well, my Dad raised me on a lot of 80’s stuff, but it would be more like Queen and Don Henley, Phil Collins, that kind of stuff.
Hell yeah, the classic rock stuff. So back to the present day, whenever anyone can get back to touring, and you get back on the road, what are some places you’re looking forward to playing?
Wow, I haven’t even thought like this in so long. It’s going to be so weird to transition from seeing maybe 2 people a day, to over a thousand, that’s going to be terrifying.
So let’s get back into the mentality now, let’s think about it, make it happen, you know?
*laughs* I mean, right before all this was starting to happen, I really wanted to be in Europe like twice a year. Because we were going one a year to once every other year, and I feel like the more you go there, the better it will do for your career, whereas America, people were starting to get spoiled from too many tours happening. And now, I don’t even know what the first tour’s going to be like, what the attendance and vibe are going to be like, but when it comes to places that I enjoy playing, I really want to go back to Japan. I’ve never been to South Africa, never been to South America before, so I’d like to finish my list and cross everything off, I guess.
Yeah, it’s good to have at least in the back of your mind, because it’s been such a long time, so let’s all start thinking about it now, get ourselves all back out there going to shows, you guys playing shows, spread the music scene again. It took a hit last year, so we’ve got to get it back up and strong again.
I definitely think it’s going to come back, it’s going to be weird — like, masks, I don’t know if masks are going to go away, that might be a thing for the rest of our lives.
I don’t know, man, it’s really hard to call anything right now. But one thing that we can call pretty easily is that Veil of Maya WILL have a new album sometime in the next year.
*laughs* Oh, yeah!
You are working on it right now, so that’s something we can be pretty certain of since the rest of life is so uncertain right now.
That is true, I can promise that.
Cool. It’s been a lot of fun talking with you today, Marc.
Likewise! Thanks for having me.
Absolutely, so maybe just give a quick summary of what’s next musically for Marc Okubo right now?
Well, I’m definitely working on new Veil so expect that. We have a tour coming up with Dance Gavin Dance, Animals As Leaders, Eidola, and Wolf & Bear, starting September 6th, I believe. So please come to that if the shows are not sold out already, and then yeah, back to business as usual. We’ll be writing and releasing and touring and doing that for as long as we can.
Awesome, good stuff to look forward to. Thanks so much for your time today, Marc!
Screenshot of Burning Witches Livestream via Live4You!
On May 28th, 2021, the Swiss/Dutch Heavy Metal band Burning Witches staged an official album release show for the world via livestream in celebration of their latest record, The Witch of the North, out now on Nuclear Blast. Burning Witches, with their current lineup consisting of Laura Guldemond (Vocals), Romana Kalkuhl (Guitar), Jeanine Grob (Bass), Lala Frischknecht (Drums), and Larissa Ernst (Guitar), showcased live performances of songs off the brand-new The Witch of the North, while also revisiting previous albums, Dance With The Devil (2020), Hexenhammer (2018), and the self-titled 2017 debut, Burning Witches.
The Witch of the North
Laura Guldemond & Lala Frischknecht
Larissa Ernst & Romana Kalkuhl
Larissa Ernst & Jeanine Grob
The eerie yet ancient entrance music of “The Witch of The North” greeted us as the ladies of Burning Witches took their places on the stage, before launching full-force like a wildfire to show us all just what Burning Witches is all about. Up next, “Wings of Steel”, with an energetic full-power intro reminiscent of traditional speed/power metal that followed through with the same energy to the end.
“Necronomicon” gives us a jolting, wailing guitar intro ominous enough for a song which personifies an ancient text into an unseen entity, while “Lucid Nightmare”, performed live, felt reminiscent of traditional thrash with an almost Exodus-like vibe, from the gritty shrieking vocals, right down to the evil laughter and rough riffs. Guitarists Romana and Larissa traded solos on this track for an inescapable sonic attack.
The anthemic “We Stand As One” is a metal song of the traditional arena sing-along sort, and once this album makes its way to being played before a live audience, no doubt that is precisely what will happen. A steady, belligerent beat from drummer Lala provides the landscape, and with lyrics like “Heavy Metal is our way, loud and fast is what we want, we stand as one”, it’s not hard to guess that Burning Witches is strong in staying true to their roots and influences.
The show continued with “Sea of Lies” off 2020’s Dance With The Devil, which was proof enough that there’s no “lies” about the band’s talents by this point. A rhythmic hooky riff pulls you in before Lala kicks in and brings it to the pace already set by the Witches in speed metal style. Bassist Janine particularly shone on this one, not only keeping a pulsating low-end for the whole track but venturing into the higher register of the instrument to generate the extra bit of energy this song deserves. “Lady Of The Woods”, off the new album, slowed things down and allowed a breather from the heavy metal attack for just a few moments, while also showing off the lower register of Laura’s live vocals. The air of mystery in the track mesmerizes the senses like the spells of the “Lady” herself.
If you took a moment to relax during the previous song, “Dance With The Devil” (2020) brought the energy right back up again, featuring some of the more pleasantly melodic riffs of the band’s repertoire, a dip into major-key melodies, and even a touch of Maiden-esque galloping rhythms. I’m sure it wasn’t just me who felt a distinctively 80’s Hard Rock energy in this track. While pondering the past, bells, a thunderstorm, and haunting screams and sounds of torture interjected to introduce the next song, “Hexenhammer”, a well-known track from the Burning Witches discography, and title track off the 2018 album of the same name. Laura puts her own unique touch on it, but still resonates with the same energy of the whole performance, in line with the 2021 vibe of Burning Witches. Newest guitarist Larissa also kept things up to speed with steady arpeggiated riffing and soloing – if perhaps, this was her first time officially playing it live, not a soul might have guessed it.
Next up was “Flight Of The Valkyries” (2021), because where would any traditional-style heavy metal band be without at least one mention of dear Valhalla? Frontwoman – or should I say Frontwitch – Laura momentarily vanished behind the on-stage cauldron to allow guitarists Romana and Larissa to shine with a twin guitar attack that truly does take flight.
With “Black Widow”, we revisited the first track off the band’s self-titled debut from 2017, ripping through metallic riffing as the band gets ready to wrap it all up. Finally, what better way for Burning Witches to close off their concert than with a song named after themselves? “Burning Witches” also comes off the 2017 debut, and serves as a real headbanging anthem to leave us satisfied with what we just watched, yet excited for more.
In spite of playing to an entirely virtual crowd, the women of Burning Witches did not hold back for even a moment in giving a full live performance experience, and even expressing gratitude to their invisible audience. The talents of Burning Witches were supplemented with great visuals, high sound quality, and effective cinematography on the livestream hosted by Live4You! A full-production stage set came equipped with cauldrons and all the necessary accouterments for a band with “witch” in their moniker, and an illustrated backdrop transformed visuals throughout to match each album cover accordingly.
There’s clearly no mistaking where the band’s influences originate, but rather than rehashing or imitating what’s been done before, they put their own unique touch and spin on traditional heavy metal sonic notions and bring us the fantastic songwriting of Burning Witches in 2021. We may have had a long time off from seeing live shows in-person, but they’re bound to return any day now – make sure you catch this fresh, strong, new energy of modern heavy metal live as soon as they hit your part of the world.
—— (All Photos are Screenshots taken during livestream hosted by “Live4You!”.)
Saxon released their new album Inspirations, a cover album featuring the artists and songs that influenced and inspired them, via Silver Lining Music this spring. I had the chance to speak with frontman Biff Byford about the story behind the new album, his solo work, music production, social media, and more.
You have the new Saxon Inspirations record which was just released, and of course Saxon has been unstoppable for years, releasing studio album after album, so I’m curious what made you want to go into a covers direction this time around?
Well, the main reason was as something fun to do, really. We didn’t want to release the new Saxon album just yet with the lockdowns everywhere, so we decided to release the new Saxon album in February, and I released my solo album over the last year. So yeah, we just thought we’d do something fun, get the band playing together again, and we thought doing an album of songs that influenced and inspired us from teenage years onward would be a good idea.
And it absolutely was a great idea, with some great results. Did you have to accommodate for the pandemic to record this, or did you have it already somewhat done before it happened?
Oh, no, it was right in the pandemic. It was done very quickly, we had the idea one week, and the next, we did it. So we created a bubble, we had already got tested a couple times, and pretty much everybody was in their own little place anyway, nobody lives in a big city. So it was easy to get together, create a bubble, stay in that bubble, and record the album, really. Yeah, it was pretty cool.
That’s good, definitely, and a good way to keep yourselves busy when you weren’t able to go out on tour.
Yeah, there’s no touring obviously, so the next best thing is recording. And it was good fun because there’s no pressure of writing songs or writing melodies for things, all that.
So when you decided what songs you wanted to cover for the album, did you all get together and talk about your influences, inspirations, and just kind of pick out some songs from that?
Well yeah, we all had ideas, it was put together very quickly. I don’t think, really, that it took us longer than a week to decide which songs to play. I didn’t go for the number one tracks of all the bands, we went for the tracks a little bit down the hit list, really. I think it worked out really well.
Absolutely, and that is a good choice, you can show your influences and inspirations without going for the obvious choices, the biggest hits.
Yeah, we could have done “Highway To Hell” or “Back In Black”, but I wanted to do an AC/DC song that I liked. And I saw them in the 70’s on their first tour of the UK, in Sheffield, a small venue, and they played that song [“Problem Child”] and I really liked it.
Out of all the tracks that you put onto Inspirations, if you had to pick one, which song or artist would you say inspired you the most out of all of them?
I would say they pretty much all did. The thing is, the album’s a mixture of inspirations and influences, if you know what I mean. Some of the bands on their inspired us, and some of the songs on there influenced our style of writing. So there’s a difference, but every song has a story connected to it, specifically to Saxon or to the member that picked the song. “Paint It Black” was chosen by Douglas, the guitarist, and that was one of the first songs I ever learned how to play on guitar, so I liked that choice as well. Things like that, really. And Nigel Glockler picked…he’s a big Sabbath fan, he liked Bill Ward’s drumming, we didn’t want to do “Paranoid” or a big hit, so we wanted to do something a little bit more off the earlier albums, and it’s not even a Sabbath song, but the band inspired us. So it’s not always about the song, sometimes it’s a band.
That’s really cool to know that there’s a personal connection for each of you in a different way, and a story related to it, that makes it a lot more meaningful than just, “Hey, let’s cover some songs for fun”, so I love that.
Yeah, it just makes it a little bit different from your average cover album. We wanted to be honest, and put songs on there that actually influenced or inspired us.
And I love that Inspirations, the release was pretty much in every format, CD, Vinyl, digital, and even a cassette format – what’s your favorite format for music would you say?
I’m not really bothered. I like vinyls because the artwork just looks better. But I don’t mind CDs, and cassette’s cool. I haven’t really got a cassette player, I might have to buy an old car or something with a cassette player in it. But I’ve got a cassette player in my studio, it sounds pretty cool on cassette. I like it for a change, it’s more analog-based. But I’m not really bothered, I don’t really have a preference. I’m not really a hi-fi buff, I’m more of a studio buff. I like to get the album sounding great – after that, everybody has a different opinion anyway, some people love vinyl, some people love CDs, some people love to stream, some people love the cassette. But a lot of people buy these limited edition things to collect.
Especially when it comes to the artwork, like you said, with vinyl, sometimes that can be a big component of it as well. Having the whole experience of the physical format, you’ve got the artwork, you take out the vinyl and it also sounds high quality. But I see what you mean, you want the original product to be as high quality as possible and everyone else can decide their own formats after that.
That’s right, you know, we do a different sort of master mix for the vinyls than we do for the CDs, so it may sound slightly different. On the cassette, there’s a little bit more level put on the tape so it sounds more authentic to back in the day. The people that work with us are very experienced in that now.
So you mentioned that you have a studio of your own, how involved do you usually get with the production in terms of the recording, mixing, mastering, etc of the Saxon records?
Well, I produced this one, and my solo album, so I’m used to working in studio, learning things and making choices. So yeah, you get involved it in altogether, people are sending me mixes and different things all the time. I have to be on it, I have to have multiple listening systems where I can check the sound on different systems. One in the car, one in studio, and one in one of the rooms in my house, so you have to check it just to make sure it’s good for the fans.
You also mentioned, of course, your solo album, School of Hard Knocks, released last year. What prompted this solo venture for you?
Well, I had a lot of songs that I wanted to put out that were personal to me, and I got the chance to work with different musicians which was really good. So yeah, we just launched the project really, it was at the beginning just before the pandemic, before March. So we were touring, but that’s been on a bit of a hold. So it was pretty good doing it, this Inspirations album is a lockdown album. And of course we can’t play live, we have to do something, otherwise I think you just waste away. And I just finished an album with my son, called Heavy Water, so that’ll be coming out soon in the next few months. So we’ve been busy really, or I have, at least.
That’s awesome! So tell me more about the album you just recorded with your son.
It’s coming out in July, I think. The album’s called Red Brick City, and the songs are very…geared more towards the lockdown, especially my son, who was going to live in a big city for the musical scene and to get working, which all stopped, so he’s been trapped in a room for months. So I think this album is a great release for that, we’ve written some great lyrics together, and we share the vocals on everything, so it sounds pretty good.
Well, I can’t wait to hear it! That’s really sweet that it’s a father/son lockdown collaboration there *laughs*.
Yeah, definitely!
And I see that you’re really active on social media, and I think it’s really cool that you still keep fans posted on what’s going on in your life, especially while they can’t come and see you play live and in person. But I see you sharing things about your family, your dogs, taking trips in the woods and countryside, so I guess that’s a good summary of your lockdown experience besides making music?
Well, people are interested. Not everybody lives in the countryside, not everybody lives in the UK, so I suppose somebody that lives in, say, Florida, looking at me walking through the English countryside, up here in Yorkshire, is different. People are interested – I don’t think any of the other guys in the band do it, but I do it. It’s pretty cool actually. We don’t get too personal, but I think it’s good fun.
I agree, I don’t think it’s oversharing at all, I think you show some cool scenery, your adorable dogs, so it’s a nice little look into your life beyond the music for the fans.
Yeah, definitely. People want to know what you’re doing, keep in touch. They go on there and have a look, they share it. And I get more followers all the time – I went from, the last time I looked, I was like two thousand people, and now I think I’ve got like, 11 or 12 thousand? It’s amazing how many people find you.
Well, you’ve got a lot of fans out there, Biff! You’re an absolute legend in the music industry and the metal world, so people are happy to see anything you share.
And we’re surprised at how successful the Inspirations album’s been, actually. It went quite high in the charts across Europe, so we were surprised. We just thought people would not be quite so excited about it, but I mean, people have really gotten into it. We’ve had some fantastic reviews and now I’m doing interviews with America now, so we’ll wait and see how that goes. It’s a good fun album though, you can put it on in the car or in the kitchen, and just listen to the songs roll by. I think it’s a really interesting album, because all of the songs are great tracks, aren’t they?
Absolutely! I mean, you have great original songs to work with, and then you put your own spin on it, which is great. It’s funny to me that you sound surprised that people are enjoying the album and having such a good time with it, but from an outside perspective and from a fan perspective, Saxon is Saxon! So whether it’s an original album or not, people are going to be excited to see new albums and new content coming from you guys.
Yeah! I mean, the whole story behind the album, and recording it in the old style, there’s a making of video on YouTube that people can watch, so the whole story’s very interesting so it’s not just about the songs. The whole story of us making it, I think people really enjoy it.
Last year, you did have a few shows scheduled just before the whole lockdown situation, there was one with Girlschool and a couple of other shows that you had lined up. I’m in the US, where some shows are starting to pop up here and there, but how are things looking in the UK, are the prospects looking good for you guys possible getting on the road later this year, or are they still on hold for now?
Well, there’s been a few shows and they’re doing some more. They just did a big one in Spain a couple of days ago with five thousand people actually inside a venue going crazy. So that one worked out really well, and only two weeks after the show, they found that four people had gotten the virus. So obviously they didn’t get it at the show, they must have got it somewhere else. So that’s looking good, they’ve done some shows in Liverpool, they’ve done a couple football matches. They’re slowly trying to get the data on how transmittable it is, everyone is asking for a negative COVID test before they can get in. I think maybe you’re going to have to have a vaccine sheet as well. But yeah, they’re moving toward gigs so hopefully in July, August, we’ll be doing some festivals.
Ah, that’d be amazing, it’s been a long time coming, everybody’s been waiting to get back out there and see shows. I’m sure you’re eager to get back out on stage as well.
We are, we are. It’s crazy that we’ve gone from a live band to a recording band *laughs*.
Yeah, in the course of a year, right? Amazing how that happened. But I’m glad to hear that the prospects are pretty good, but you’re definitely keeping busy between the Saxon and solo album, and now your album with your son, which is going to be cool to hear how that sounds when it comes out. It’s been absolutely delightful talking with you, Biff…
You too.
…so I’ll just wrap it up with a summary of what’s next on the plate for Biff Byford?
Well, like I said, we’ve got this album coming out with my son, the project’s called Heavy Water and the album’s called Red Brick City, so that’ll be coming out soon. The next Saxon album will be out in February, I think it’s February the 14th, and I think the Heavy Water album will probably be out in July. So not long to go before that comes out. So yeah, things are looking pretty good, we’re all trying to keep fit and active which is really hard in lockdown *laughs*. But hopefully we’ll be able to come to America and do some shows.
Everybody would love to see you out here for sure. Good luck with everything, and we’re looking forward to hearing these new albums coming from you. Stay healthy and give your dogs some extra pats from me!
Holy Diver Live and Evil Or Divine: Live In New York City are two new Dio live album reissues that were released last month via BMG. I had the chance to talk with iconic drummer Simon Wright about the reissues, his memories of the tours and some stories of Ronnie James Dio, the Dio Returns hologram tours and Dio Disciples, as well as some new side projects and albums Simon recently recorded on. Check it out below:
The main topic that brings us here today is of course the Dio album reissues, Holy Diver Live and Evil Or Divine: Live in New York City, and that one is particularly close to me as a New Yorker myself, but I just want to start with your thoughts on these albums being reissued now?
I think it’s great, especially at a time right now when you can’t go see any live shows. Doing Evil Or Divine and the Holy Diver Live shows was a great time because the band, we were really tight, we’d been playing a lot of shows. I remember we were really comfortable with things, we’d been throwing things in here and there, and Ronnie was singing his ass off. So it was great, they’re great memories, and I still can’t believe I was involved. You look at the listings of these songs, classics. But they were great nights, absolutely.
So seeing these reissues coming about now, do you find yourself reminiscing on these tours?
I do, I must admit. They were great shows, like I said, the band was really tight, and Doug was playing his ass off. It’s funny though, when you play the capitals of these states and countries and stuff, you always get a lot of people come along, your friends and stuff. It makes it a little difficult at the same time, you’re glad to see them, but when you know that they’re recording a live DVD and there’s cameras everywhere, you have to step away for a minute before you play and collect your thoughts. Get ready for it, you know? Which is what happens. But I think it turned out pretty good.
Definitely, it turned out amazing! But I see what you mean, there’s an extra kind of layer of pressure that’s added to the performance there, like, “All right, this is being immortalized here with a live album”.
Exactly! You’re thinking, “oh, I’ve got to do something in a minute”, and this guy’s talking in your ear, you’re like, “oh, I’ve gotta go”. *laughs*
*laughs* I mean, especially now, every single show is getting recorded, everyone’s got everything on their phones. Back when these albums were made originally, that wasn’t necessarily the case, you didn’t have somebody recording every single performance you did all the time, so I guess that’s the difference now.
Yeah. I find myself kind of ignoring them, but I’ve got a bit of camouflage back there, with cymbals and stuff. It must be a pain in the ass sometimes to lead singers, dealing with it. It’s almost surreal, am I singing to you or am I singing to your phone?
That’s a good point. So in the case of the Holy Diver Live record, though you weren’t on the original recording of Holy Diver, you had plenty of time playing those tracks on the road before the live album came out. So when you did that tour run, did it feel like your chance to put your own spin on those tracks?
I think so, yeah. I mean, I didn’t go over the top and I respected the parts that Vinny Appice had played, I think. At least, that’s what I tried to do, I always try to do that when I’m playing other people’s songs. Whether it be Vinny, or Bill Ward, or Cozy Powell, you respect what they’ve done. But it was great, along the years, we’d play the usual standards off of Holy Diver, like “Stand Up And Shout”, and the title track, “Holy Diver”. But to dig a little deeper into it, and do “Gypsy” and “Caught In The Middle”, “Invisible”, awesome songs, you know? And we get to play those songs in the set, it’s amazing. To build a whole set around the whole album, that was something else, I think it turned out really cool.
Absolutely. I like when full albums are turned into tours, shows, live albums, and stuff like that, I feel like it is interesting for both the musicians and the audience, because you’re getting a new perspective. A lot of the time for albums, like you said, there are singles, certain hit tracks that will come along on tour no matter what, but you don’t always get a chance to revisit the deeper tracks, or see how they would be live. Sometimes they just get laid down in studio once and that’s that.
Some albums have a link with each song, they link together not in a concept way, just at that moment in time when they were recorded, the sound, the feel, the energy. And you’re right, it’s good to hear those tracks, but I think it’s even better to hear the whole album.
Definitely, and I notice that a couple of your drum solos are now featured on the reissues as well, and I love when individual solos are captured on live records, because it’s capturing that musical moment in time, whether it’s something improvised, something that just kind of happened. I wonder, do you tend to go into solos with any kind of map or plan in your mind at all, or is it just, whatever happens, happens, I’m just going to play?
That’s a good question. There are certain things that I do, little fills and little sections that I stick to that have just evolved over the years. In between, I kind of mess around but get ready for the next part, and then I’ll do that part. And I’ll get out of that and I’ll keep jiggling around a little bit, then go in for the next part that I remember. But another thing is, Ronnie was nothing but encouragement with creating a musical part of the drum solo. I’ve put in 1812 there, and Jupiter from Holst, just because it’s that same old adage of, “Oh God, not another boring drum solo”. We just decided to make it a bit more interesting, put in the music, and I think it turned out okay.
I see what you mean, I think in Dio’s music in general, and I just mean anything to do with Ronnie, any project associated with him, there is always that sense of classic musicality that comes through. There’s always so much going on in the instrumentation and with his vocals together, but at the same time it’s never too much, never too flourishy or too distracting, still heavy metal at its roots. So I definitely see what you’re talking about there.
Yeah, you’re right, absolutely. He always had that kind of classical metal vibe in some of his songs and stuff, that kind of orchestral feeling now and again. Which I love, I think it’s amazing!
And speaking of Ronnie, of course, out of the many people who have played with him, you probably were one of the closest people to him. I actually read that once when you considering quitting music, he was actually somebody who helped you stick with it.
He did! I was having a really rough time, we were on the road in Scandinavia and I got a whole bunch of horrible phone calls from my ex-wife…well, she wasn’t my ex-wife at the time, but she wanted to be. And I think I wanted her to be, too. *laughs* I was just pissed off with the whole thing, and he said, “No, no, come back to L.A., stay at my place”. And lots of people had stayed at his house there, he had a really beautiful, big house. So I did that, and 13 years later, I was still there. We got to mess around on the house, work on the house and keep ourselves preoccupied, so I saw another side of him away from the music. We worked on music there as well, obviously, but we did a lot of building projects together and stuff, and those are times I’ll never forget. You turn around and you’re building a wall with Ronnie James Dio *laughs* like, “Wait a minute, hang on a minute, what’s going on here?”
*laughs* That’s so funny, I love that.
And I got to know him, and he’s such a generous, funny person, really. He had his angry sides to him, he was the boss, though, he had a lot on his shoulders. Some stuff just caught up with him and he’d get angry and stuff, people have seen that, people know that. But I really, really miss him. I wish he was here.
Aww. Absolutely. Probably some of that fire is where his big heavy metal vocals came from.
That’s the thing, you know! If you listen to some of his vocals, there’s a real anger behind them. He’s not just singing for the sake of singing, he’s putting his heart and soul into some of those lyrics and that singing. He’s amazing.
I’m curious to ask you, because you were also part of the Dio Returns hologram tour, and there’s been a lot of mixed reviews on that. I personally saw it, I thought it was a great show, I thought it was cool, especially as someone who unfortunately never had the chance to see Ronnie while he was still here, so that was the closest I could possibly come to seeing a depiction of him onstage. As someone so close to him, do you feel that it truly was a great tribute to him?
Yeah, I think so, that’s where we’re coming from. We just want to keep his music alive and his memory. Me and Craig, Scott Warren and Rudy as well. You can’t just walk away from it and not play that music anymore, and you can’t walk away from him like that. We were all around long enough to become part of his family, so that’s really where we’re coming from. We’re just remembering him with as much respect as possible. And that’s the whole premise behind it really, because it cost a lot of money to put it on, so it’s give and take, you know?
I mean, doing projects like Dio Returns and Dio Disciples as well, I’m sure you interact with a lot of fans that ask you about Ronnie, working with him and knowing him, or maybe have memories to share of their own, or like I said in my case, fans that never actually had the chance to see him when he was still with us. What does it mean to you to be someone who is helping to uphold his memory, and help continue his music and his stories, keeping it alive?
I feel good about doing that, and I’m happy to do it. You’re right, actually, the proof in the pudding is kind of when we meet people after the show, the fans who say what a fantastic job we’re doing and all. We don’t live for that, we do it to keep Ronnie’s memory alive and stuff like that. Like you said, people who never got a chance to see Ronnie now get a chance to get a glimpse of him in one form, the best form we can do at the moment. So yeah, it’s good to know that we’re doing a good thing. The people who don’t get it, that’s fine, just don’t show up. Sit in your bedroom and spout a lot of shit on your computer, you know, that’s fine. We’re going to get on with it anyway. *laughs*
*laughs* Now, another thing I wanted to ask you about Dio Disciples, a couple of years ago at this point, I interviewed Craig Goldy, and he mentioned that you guys had an album in the works for Dio Disciples, and I know that kind of got put on hold for the Dio Returns tour as well. I’m curious if you guys found any time during this lockdown situation to return to it at all?
No, we haven’t, really. Craig’s been doing some other recording projects, and I’ve been fortunate enough to do a couple of albums. There was nothing going on for the longest time, it’s probably like that for lots of musicians right now. But it’s still on hold, we’re concentrating on Dio Returns for the moment. We had like four or five good ideas for that album, they still need work, I think. But it’s been a long time since we’ve approached that subject, so it’s still on hold.
That’s okay, you’ve still got a lot going on for sure, especially with the Dio Returns, it’s a whole life of its own there. I’m curious what that was like to rehearse and coordinate something like that, literally half live band and one part hologram, how do you work that out in rehearsals?
Well, it was a bit strange, when I first saw the hologram, it was a little spooky. The hairs on your arm stand up a bit, it was pretty amazing. But on my end, I had to learn how to play with the click track live, because the click track runs with Ronnie’s voice, that voice is taken from different old performances, and then the band basically plays along to me and Ronnie. But I’m the one who keeps things on track, so that was a little bit terrifying first couple of times. And then you’ve got to have the guy starting the click, he’s got to be on the ball too, for the right amount of time. So it took a little bit of working out, but we finally got it sorted, I’m not afraid of it anymore.
That’s good, but that is a bit spooky now that you say it that way, it’s like echoes of concerts gone by that you have to coordinate into one, there. It’s cool though, it’s a very innovative way of approaching this kind of thing.
Yeah! It is. Frankly, it’s the only way it can be done. But I remember one night, like I said, the monitor guy who starts the click, he started one one night and it was a different song. *laughs* I’m like, “stop!!” *laughs*
Oh my goodness, that’s funny. Well, it’s amazing to be talking to you about Dio, Ronnie, and Dio Returns stuff, but I want to just ask you, because you mentioned just now you have some albums you’ve been involved in, other projects you have going on. Maybe you can give us an outlook of what’s on the horizon for Simon Wright right now?
Sure, thanks! I mean, for the longest time, there was nothing going on, just like for a lot of musicians. But these last couple of months, I got a call from a friend of mine, Stuart Smith, he has a band called Heaven and Earth, and he asked me if I’d like to do the album. I said, “sure, that sounds cool”, and that’s pretty much done. Unfortunately, it’s going to be out in August, that’s a couple of months away, but then a couple of weeks later, my friend Kevin Goocher called, he’s a singer, has a band called Of Gods & Monsters, so I did that album as well. They’re still putting guitars on that, and vocals and stuff at the moment. It got really busy there for a couple of months, and like I said, before, there was nothing. So that was pretty good!
Yeah! Okay, so we have some band names to keep an eye out for some extracurricular work from Simon, there.
Yeah, keep an eye out!
Absolutely. Thanks so much for your time today, really awesome getting a chance to talk with you, you are a legend in your own right, so thanks so much for taking the time to talk with me.
Nice talking with you, Chelsea, take care now, be safe.
Jef Rhodes is the mastermind behind Them Damn Kings, whose debut album Rise Up is set for an early 2021 release. Though it may be a debut album, this is far from Jef’s debut in the music industry, with plenty of road years and experiences under his belt, including long runs as a Front of House Engineer and Backline Tech for bands such as Lacuna Coil, Cradle of Filth, Opeth, Mayhem, and more. I had the chance to talk with Jef about the new album from Them Damn Kings, how Jef got his start in the industry, memorable road antics with Motörhead and Megadeth, and a great rock and roll message to close things out. Check it out below:
Them Damn Kings, you’re headed to releasing your debut album, Rise Up – start with some ideas that went into the making of the record?
Well, there’s not much of an idea that goes in behind it – you get in there, you just want to make a rock and roll record, and whatever comes out is what comes out. We don’t really do too much planning, whatever happens is what happens and that’s the time it’s meant to happen.
Now, even though this is the debut full-length for Them Damn Kings, you did actually have an EP a few years back, talk about the time and the differences between the two, and what led to your going for the full-length now?
There was a lot of drinkin’ involved, I’ll tell you! *laughs* I’ve been playing since I was fourteen years old, and been in and out of bands for most of my life. I’ve been out there doing the sound guy routine, the crew thing, and I just felt it was time to put out something. I just kind of sat in the house, and if a song came out, all right, that’s cool, we’ve got something going on. And one thing kind of leads to another, a good friend of mine, Adam, it was time to start moving forward and he came on board and started managing us. Now here we are making the full-length.
There you go, that’s awesome. So I’ve heard that this album was actually made as a one-man band, but when the time to actually go out live comes around, it looks like you already have some plans for the live lineup as well?
I do, it definitely was kind of a one-man situation. I played everything on the EP, I was going to do the same thing on this, but I just wanted to get involved with more people. Ryan had just left Lacuna Coil, and so I said “Hey man, why don’t you fly out and do the drums to this?” and we ended up having a great time doing it and a lot of things just ended up happening, the songs took on a whole new shape when he sat down and started playing. So yeah, when I go out and do the live thing, we’ve got Ryan on drums, floating around with Tony from the band Kyng, and we’ve got Gogi on rhythm guitar, and so we’re just waiting for this pandemic to be over so we can get out there and start blowing the roof off these joints again.
Hell yeah, everybody’s waiting to get back out there again!
I know, it’s crazy times.
So when you did do the EP, and the more one-man setup, you obviously have audio engineering experience from your time on the road, so were you just doing all the recording and everything yourself?
Yeah, I do, I got out of Jersey a couple of years ago and got a nice place down here in Savannah, Georgia, and lo and behold, the house that I found was absolutely perfect, the whole thing is basically a recording studio now. I’ve got a bedroom that I sleep in, and the rest of the house is just music stuff everywhere. So I just started building this up over the last couple of years, I’ve always had some way to record and bought a rather large console a long time ago, and this is kind of the center of my recording, everything’s still basically analog here, and trying to limit myself to what I have, you know? I really don’t like overproduced, the over polished stuff. Nowadays you can get away with a million tracks in Pro Tools, but what I got is what I use, and we just limit ourselves to that, and I feel that you get a little bit more creative in how to do things that way.
Absolutely! I love the analog sound on recordings, but that also means you had to take all that equipment down from Jersey to Georgia, transporting that carefully, huh? *laughs*
I did, and actually I’ve got a basement down here, and one thing you don’t do is buy a house with a basement in the South. That was a bad idea. So originally, I planned to build the studio in the basement, when I bought the place, the seller was like, “yeah, the basement doesn’t leak”, so six months into it – I go downstairs, “what’s that smell, what’s all that noise?” and water’s up to my knees, and basically all of my gear was almost destroyed. I spent probably a good four months ripping this console apart, and this console was literally underwater, and I tore the whole thing apart. That was such a heartbreak right there. So, 90% of the gear is restored, and there’s clicks and pops now, it kind of took on its own new life. I kind of like that, it gives it a newer, dirtier sound that’s not really meant to be there, you know?
I mean, I guess it gave it character, but what a rough way to get it though.
That’s definitely a rough way to get it. I’m glad it survived, and it was a pretty major undertaking putting all this gear back together again. You know, you’re like, wow, there’s so much money invested into this stuff and to see it underwater, that was almost it for me, you know?
Man, so you had to do a total rebuild?
Literally, and finding parts for this old console from the mid-80’s was near impossible. I just started having to salvage things off of it, and ended up finding another one online for a couple of hundred dollars that was just a parts console, picked that thing up and ripped it apart and just tried to get all these components back together as best as I could – and I’m not exactly an electrical engineer, you know? So now I’m waiting for it to catch fire next *laughs*.
*laughs* But still, you’ve got the audio engineering experience, I know you did some front of house, you did backline, you do have that experience working with audio equipment, so I’m curious what got you into audio and engineering in general, and how did you get your start in that direction?
I didn’t mean for it to happen! I was playing the circuit back in Jersey, and there was this old club called Obsessions, and we used to play there quite often, about 20 bands ago. And the kid who was the audio guy there happened to own the equipment and he wanted to get out of everything, and it wasn’t great equipment, but it was a club and it came with clients, and I was like, “Sure, I’ll chuck ya a couple of bucks and try my hand at this”. Ruined a lot of shows in the beginning blowing gear up *laughs* but that’s just kind of how I fell into it. And then I got this crazy idea, I couldn’t afford anything back then, cool lights and all that kind of stuff, so I had started making lights out of coffee cans. I found this hospital bed motor and I wired all these lights up on this little truss they had at the club, and with the hospital bed motor you could get the lights to move back and forth. So it was my version of moving lights, and then a band would come through and be like, “This is really cool, come out with us!” So I started touring, doing audio and lights on the side there, and next thing led to another and I’m out with another, and next thing led to another and somehow I got to Cradle of Filth, and I was out with those guys for a few years. Then one thing leads to another, and I’ve been out with Lacuna Coil for 12 years now.
I love it, you fell into it, strung up some lights, and now you’re touring the world.
*laughs* That’s how it happens.
It was probably meant to be then, even if you didn’t feel like it at the time. But that’s cool, you were kind of winging it and learning on the job, that was very creative.
That’s just kind of how you have to do it, I mean, lights are BS anyway, right? You got to BS your way through it – good lesson for you kids out there! Just do it!
That’s great. So you mentioned just a couple of bands that you’ve been out with, and you’ve gone on some great tours, I’m sure you have great stories. But overall, what do you feel have been some of the most memorable tours that you’ve been a part of?
I mean, being out with Lacuna’s really opened up a lot of different things. Growing up, Megadeth was one of my favorite bands, so we got to do the Gigantour, that was just great. Dave Mustaine is such a trip, I think that’s probably one of the most memorable, considering Motörhead was on that too. Between Motörhead and Megadeth and the antics that were going on, it was probably the best and craziest tour I’ve ever been on. Got a real good taste of rock and roll on that one!
I bet, man!
Oh, man, I could go on for days and days about that tour. Every hour was something different, you know? *laughs*
I can imagine, it must have been crazy to have those two bands on the same bill. Just trying to make audio and lights work and survive the antics? Must have been insane.
I mean, Lemmy got me so…I almost got fired off that tour, Lemmy got me so hammered before I was supposed to go and do my job. I remember waking up on the mixing desk, I had passed out and pushed all the faders all the way up *laughs*. People are just hitting me like, “What the hell are you doing, man?” and my tour manager wanted me GONE, man. I was like, “it’s not my fault, man, I was walking around backstage and Lemmy grabbed me and basically shoved a bottle of Jack down my throat”. Then it was, “Well…well, as long as it was Lemmy that did it to you, you’re fine”.
Oh! It can be forgiven because it was Lemmy. *laughs*
That’s the ONLY reason! So, God rest his soul, thank you, Lemmy.
Exactly. It’s funny, any kind of story I’ve ever heard from anyone about Lemmy, it’s always been good stuff. Even if he got you in a little bit of trouble, just his name alone saved you there. A lot of people love him as a person, and say he did a lot for people, so that’s pretty cool.
He was a great guy.
Aside from that being so super memorable for you, if you could tour with any artist at all that you haven’t met, haven’t been on tour with, or maybe have met and just haven’t gotten to tour with – just if you could tour with anyone you wanted at all, who would it be?
That’s easy for me, it would be Zakk Wylde all the way. He’s the one guy, and I’ve met a ton of people, I’ve done probably a hundred shows with him. We’ve been out doing festivals with Black Label Society, and Ozzy and all that. Literally probably been five inches away from Zakk at times, and the moment has just never presented itself to be like, “Hey!”. Every time I’d turn around like, “What’s going on, man?”, he vanished. That would be the one guy that I think would just…one of us would probably leave dead off of that run, you know?
Even crazier than the Megadeth/Motörhead thing, right?
I mean, it’s good because Zakk doesn’t drink anymore, so I’d probably keep myself in check. But, I couldn’t even imagine if it was the Motörhead and Megadeth, and Black Label or Ozzy doing that run. We’d all be dead, I can’t believe we all survived that tour.
*laughs* But you all did, and good thing. So, for your new music, Rise Up, there’s plans for it to be released in 2021, I’m sure that was a bit of pandemic delay there, but that’s okay, everybody’s in the same boat. So just your thoughts looking toward the album being released next year?
I’m excited, I’m glad it’s not being released this year. The mastering came back about ten days before everything just shut down and went into lockdown. So, we kind of regrouped, and I’ve been speaking with management and all those guys about what to do here, and I’m glad it’s happening toward the end of the year. I’m even more so glad that 2020 is not going to be stamped on that album, because I just don’t want that stigma whatsoever, who knows what would happen? We’re really excited about it happening, it’s supposed to be coming out next spring, tentatively now. But I know we’re going to put out a couple more singles before then and try to get everybody rounded up and listening to it, and hopefully we’ll push and tour it. I think we just need to get back out there and play again, you know? That’s what it really comes down to, I think that’s where we shine the most. Because there’s no BS with us, the antics speak for themselves.
So obviously, the focus is really on Rise Up right now, since that’s projected for next year, so I assume you don’t have any plans for future records right now, just kind of focusing on this one for now?
You know, I always want to make music. I sit up here just about every day jamming, but it’s kind of a difficult thing, because I don’t go into a, “Let’s make a record” type of situation, you know? If I could, I’d put out a record every single month, that’s insane to even say, but that’s just the way — next month, my taste might change, you know? I listen to so much different stuff and I feel like every day, especially now, you’re just influenced by so many outside factors that they change on a daily basis. And so when the songs are coming out, it’s just different, it’s a different time, moment, and memory for me. But, that being said, I think we are planning, next spring or summer, if we’re all still camped out in lockdown, to at least get us all in the studio and just kind of Led Zeppelin it and see what happens in a week or two, you know?
Yeah, absolutely. So you were talking about being influenced by a lot of different things, but what are some bands, some styles of music that are influencing you lately?
Every day changes, one minute it’s Pop Evil, next minute it’s Stanley Jordan or Leo Kottke, or back to Megadeth. I’ve got about 5000 CDs downstairs and that’s not even included records or my terrabyte hard drives. There’s new music coming out every day, it’s really hard not to be influenced by it all. This was kind of the problem though, my mind works in such a ADHD way, I’m just kind of like everybody else listening to music, it’s like, “Wow, this is great!” and then 5 minutes later YouTube or Spotify puts you on something else, and you’re going, “Wow, this is great!”, it’s just constant all over the place. Like you ended up having 15 pots of coffee before 10 in the morning, you know? Which is the way that the industry is right now, but you can never go wrong with Ozzy, so I’ve always got Ozzy jamming at least once a day. I think for me, it’s just seeing the way the world is right now, between the political campaigns and all the BS that’s happening, the way people are reacting to the whole pandemic and the whole being told what you can and can’t do. It’s chaos out there right now, and it always keeps me bringing back to, we’ve got to get shows rocking and rolling again, because people are falling apart, you know?
Good point. But that’s good that you’re well rounded and listen to a little bit of everything, that just means you appreciate music, and you’re able to channel that into your own writing, so that’s cool.
Absolutely, where would we be without music? I’ve never been shut off like that. I’m a rock and roller til the day I die, but I can appreciate and respect a lot of stuff out there.
That’s great. Is there anything about Them Damn Kings that you want new fans just discovering you to know?
We like booze, bring them to us! *laughs* Nah, it’s just straight up rock and roll, you know? I grew up with rock and roll, I feel like that whole rock and roll way of life is just dying, it’s a dying breed, there’s not too many of us left. I think the older generation can really appreciate that, but I really want the younger generation to understand what rock and roll is really about. It’s not computers, not being perfect. It’s about being yourself, mistakes happen, and you just dust yourself off and move on with it. It’s a party out there, be happy!
There you go, that’s an awesome message, I love it!
Right on.
Well, thank you so much for your time today, Jef, I’ll let you get back to your day, but it was a lot of fun talking with you.
Thank you, same, I appreciate it, thank you very much.
